BOTOC Darwin Pass Around - Reviews Thread

[jamesspo]

Thanks for the kind words folks. I think for my follow up shaves I'm going to use both razors at the same time - one on each side of my face. That way I can get a little closer memory of each and really compare.

ShavingBacon: Thanks for the feedback and your impression of the Deluxe. As I mentioned, I'm only two shaves in on these guys, so possible I haven't squeezed out everything I can from the Deluxe. I really focused on using the razor's native shave angle, vs really experimenting much with other angles, so we'll see how it goes. The standard and deluxe are actually quite close to each other...one on either side of the New SC in terms of aggressiveness for me. But it's not mild in the overall sense, just relative to the standard, and milder than my usual R41 shaves. I agree with you on first pass take down, they both did very well on that as do most of my open combs. I'd like to see pictures of yours as well...it'd be interesting if there are differences between copies of the same model.

Haiku, Cal1961, if you're able to take pictures of your Standards, I'd really like to see them. A shot of the razor assembled looking at the head, either straight on at the shaving side, or maybe even a good square shot from the top. I'd also be interested in a front on shot like the one below with a blade installed. If you're game for close up profile shots like I did with the angle measurements, that would be even better...but those are PITA to do, trust me :). I was using a special add-on close up lens for that, and it takes a lot of shots and tweaking.

I need to take some better pictures of Connie's Standard for this, but here's one that sort of shows the cap issue:



As you an see the whole cap is shifted to the left a bit. On a top down shot it's actually rotated clockwise a tad as well. It's possible this is a key reason for the difference I feel between these two.

[jamesspo]

My dad's going to talk to the cobalt alloys guy today, to see what he can learn. As a bonus the guy is also connected to industry in Sheffield, so may have some contacts there that can help. I've forgotten what my dad said his connection was..whether he was born there, or worked there, or what. Anyway, he thought that the guy may have some leads on further research.

Thanks so much for such a great lead off to this pass around. I'm really looking forward to seeing what the metalurgists can figure out about these razors.

[ShavinBacon]

Not sure why, but I found this funny! In less than two sentences you went from RAD being dead, to basically dead. A true B&B'r!

Yes well, if I am admitting the whole truth...I have always wanted a Aristocrat #15 or really, the anglo-american hybrid...Can u tell I like British razors?

Also, the only 2 other razors I am remotely interested in now is a Tradere OC or the new R41 as I don't own any modern razors. Not sure if I will ever pursue any these though. I have tried every razor I could get my hands on (barring straights) and I have settled on my current collection.

As you an see the whole cap is shifted to the left a bit. On a top down shot it's actually rotated clockwise a tad as well.

You mentioned the handle being slippery for you. I have not had that problem with mine but I could see where that might be a problem with the smooth finish. Actually it amazes how perfectly balanced the Deluxe is in my hands. That's probably part of the reason I love mine so. For my shaving routine, this razor fits me to a T...not too head or handle heavy but overall a very solid, hefty feel. And the shape of the handle gives me a solid flat surface to grip and ridges to know exactly where the head was. When I take new pics of mine, u might be able to tell that my cap has the same issue as Connie's. But very very slightly. My OCD sees it and makes a bigger deal out of it than it should be. It doesn't affect the shave at all. I notice it more when a blade is inserted than anything. I will get some new and hopefully, better pics in a few days. Until then, these pics I took when I first got it will have to suffice.

[Haiku]

Thanks for the kind words folks. I think for my follow up shaves I'm going to use both razors at the same time - one on each side of my face. That way I can get a little closer memory of each and really compare.

ShavingBacon: Thanks for the feedback and your impression of the Deluxe. As I mentioned, I'm only two shaves in on these guys, so possible I haven't squeezed out everything I can from the Deluxe. I really focused on using the razor's native shave angle, vs really experimenting much with other angles, so we'll see how it goes. The standard and deluxe are actually quite close to each other...one on either side of the New SC in terms of aggressiveness for me. But it's not mild in the overall sense, just relative to the standard, and milder than my usual R41 shaves. I agree with you on first pass take down, they both did very well on that as do most of my open combs. I'd like to see pictures of yours as well...it'd be interesting if there are differences between copies of the same model.

Haiku, Cal1961, if you're able to take pictures of your Standards, I'd really like to see them. A shot of the razor assembled looking at the head, either straight on at the shaving side, or maybe even a good square shot from the top. I'd also be interested in a front on shot like the one below with a blade installed. If you're game for close up profile shots like I did with the angle measurements, that would be even better...but those are PITA to do, trust me :). I was using a special add-on close up lens for that, and it takes a lot of shots and tweaking.

I need to take some better pictures of Connie's Standard for this, but here's one that sort of shows the cap issue:



As you an see the whole cap is shifted to the left a bit. On a top down shot it's actually rotated clockwise a tad as well. It's possible this is a key reason for the difference I feel between these two.

I'll try to get a picture or two of mine, but that may take a few days as I need to find some time and perhaps borrow a better camera than mine is. It's not at all good on closeups that need any kind of magnification.

I've never looked as closely or as carefully at my Darwin as you have, and I'ver certainly learned a great deal from the care you took in these reviews. Thank you!

The holes in the bottom plate are all equal on mine, but the cap does sit a bit to the left and it is rotated clockwise just a very little bit. I'm wondering whether this is intended to slant the blade providing a guillotine action like the Merkur slant. Although I am always careful to align the blade as best I can, the blade does have a very very slight slant to it. I'm wondering whether this is a design feature - a slightly slanted blade making the Darwin a sort of slant razor.

Here's why I'm thinking it's a design feature and not careless manufacturing: the blade sits exactly the same way on both edges. It's very very slighly higher on the left side than the right, and very very slightly turned clockwise. The gap is greater on the left than the right as well. Because it's equal on both sides I'm thinking that this was a design decision. And this may be why so many of us think that our Darwins are such great shavers: they are almost like quasi-slants.

[Dr Roadrash]

I'll post some close up pics of my standard when I get home. This is great James. Thanks for starting this. I think there is going to be some significant variation in build on all of these Darwins. We will now compare.
Aaron

[ShavinBacon]

The holes in the bottom plate are all equal on mine, but the cap does sit a bit to the left and it is rotated clockwise just a very little bit. I'm wondering whether this is intended to slant the blade providing a guillotine action like the Merkur slant. Although I am always careful to align the blade as best I can, the blade does have a very very slight slant to it. I'm wondering whether this is a design feature - a slightly slanted blade making the Darwin a sort of slant razor.

Here's why I'm thinking it's a design feature and not careless manufacturing: the blade sits exactly the same way on both edges. It's very very slighly higher on the left side than the right, and very very slightly turned clockwise. The gap is greater on the left than the right as well. Because it's equal on both sides I'm thinking that this was a design decision. And this may be why so many of us think that our Darwins are such great shavers: they are almost like quasi-slants.

I'm liking this thought process. Mine definitely slices the hairs off my face like no other razor I have tried and I never got around to trying a slant.

[Gam]

Great review James

[Cal1961]

Thanks for the kind words folks. I think for my follow up shaves I'm going to use both razors at the same time - one on each side of my face. That way I can get a little closer memory of each and really compare.

ShavingBacon: Thanks for the feedback and your impression of the Deluxe. As I mentioned, I'm only two shaves in on these guys, so possible I haven't squeezed out everything I can from the Deluxe. I really focused on using the razor's native shave angle, vs really experimenting much with other angles, so we'll see how it goes. The standard and deluxe are actually quite close to each other...one on either side of the New SC in terms of aggressiveness for me. But it's not mild in the overall sense, just relative to the standard, and milder than my usual R41 shaves. I agree with you on first pass take down, they both did very well on that as do most of my open combs. I'd like to see pictures of yours as well...it'd be interesting if there are differences between copies of the same model.

Haiku, Cal1961, if you're able to take pictures of your Standards, I'd really like to see them. A shot of the razor assembled looking at the head, either straight on at the shaving side, or maybe even a good square shot from the top. I'd also be interested in a front on shot like the one below with a blade installed. If you're game for close up profile shots like I did with the angle measurements, that would be even better...but those are PITA to do, trust me :). I was using a special add-on close up lens for that, and it takes a lot of shots and tweaking.

I need to take some better pictures of Connie's Standard for this, but here's one that sort of shows the cap issue:




As you an see the whole cap is shifted to the left a bit. On a top down shot it's actually rotated clockwise a tad as well. It's possible this is a key reason for the difference I feel between these two.

I will try and take a picture but my camera is not so good and I am travelling so maybe a couple of days.

[Haiku]

I'm liking this thought process. Mine definitely slices the hairs off my face like no other razor I have tried and I never got around to trying a slant.

You ought to. The Merkur slant is a great razor and I've begun to think that perhaps Darwin was onto a version of that type of design.

Somewhere on this Board is the name of the fellow who owned Darwin and took out the patent on the razor. Anybody have a link to that post? Perhaps the patent information will have a clue about the design ideas. I remember looking at it but didn't read it carefully. But there was definitely something about the design of the head of the razor as being an improvement over others which, I assume, is why the patent was in fact granted.

[jamesspo]

I don't know guys, I'm not sure I buy that it would be some sort of slant feature. It's certainly possible, but it seems like if it was it would have been mentioned in the patent, and more consistently implemented across instances of the razor. Connie's Deluxe for instance shows no such cant to the cap. It would also be extremely subtle if it was intentional. On the patent number listed on the standard.. I finally found it after quite a bit of searching...

http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publi...=&locale=en_EP

Just searching for the number at the UK patent office didn't turn up anything. The number on the of Deluxe models (710725) appears to be a "Registered Design" number, instead of a patent number. Searches for that have been unsuccessful for me as well....maybe you guys will have better luck!

I have not had a chance to read through the patent thoroughly. It certainly looks interesting, and there seems to be a rhyme and reason to the shape of the head, and how it holds the blade, but is mainly focused on how the blade is clamped down, and the angle of the blade with respect to the shape of the cap (to sort of simulate a straight razor's hollow grind). I'll try to give it a good read tonight. Note, you might want to read the original copy, rather that the OCR'd text.

You ought to. The Merkur slant is a great razor and I've begun to think that perhaps Darwin was onto a version of that type of design.

Somewhere on this Board is the name of the fellow who owned Darwin and took out the patent on the razor. Anybody have a link to that post? Perhaps the patent information will have a clue about the design ideas. I remember looking at it but didn't read it carefully. But there was definitely something about the design of the head of the razor as being an improvement over others which, I assume, is why the patent was in fact granted.

[Intrigued]

Here is a link I found for Paul Kuehnrich's GB patent application 243,881..... http://www.prior-ip.com/application/...-safety-razors

[Cal1961]

I posted a photo of a Darwin I had not seen before in another thread it is not a Standard or Deluxe. Just don not know how to move it here - sorry

[Intrigued]

I posted a photo of a Darwin I had not seen before in another thread it is not a Standard or Deluxe. Just don not know how to move it here - sorry

Here you go..... http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthr...fferent-Darwin






Cal1961, your friend's Darwin looks a lot like the drawing of the Darwin in that patent application I just posted.

[bluesbishop]

This has been a great thread, and an excellent post James.....we are all going to have a very tough act to follow.

[Cal1961]

Here you go..... http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthr...fferent-Darwin






Cal1961, your friend's Darwin looks a lot like the drawing of the Darwin in that patent application I just posted.

Connie you are right it does look very similiar. As posted in the other thread ...'early version'?

[jamesspo]

Interesting..it is very close to that drawing. The standard is a fair departure from that and the deluxe somewhere in the middle. I wish we could date these razors better.

Connie you are right it does look very similiar. As posted in the other thread ...'early version'?

[missingskin]

A few pics of my Standard, sorry had to do these in a rush. I will try to get better ones over the next few days. A few points, the handle on mine has no markings and seems more like the one on Connie's Deluxe. The rest you can decide for yourself?
Note the tooling marks in pics 1 & 2

[missingskin]

Pics in no particular order btw.........

[Haiku]

Here's the patent:

[hide][top]Abstract of GB243881 (A)

Translate this text into Tooltip

>

243,881. Kuehnrich, P. R. Nov. 3, 1924. Razors, safety. In a safety razor in which the blade is clamped between a backing and a guard, the clamping-surfaces 17 on the guard 12 are raised above the combs 15 and the backing 11 bridges the surfaces 17 both longitudinally and transversely so that the blade is clamped at four points only. As shown the backing is formed with a concave inner surface 18 and its longitudinal edges are thin so as to give a spring action when clamped to the guard; the outer surfaces of the backing are preferably formed with two concavesurfaces 19, 20 meeting at a central ridge. The positioning-pins on the backing have base portions 24 accurately fitting the apertures in the blade and guard and conical portions 21 or inclined faces guiding the apertures to the base portions. The clamping-surfaces may be formed by projections or bosses at the four corners of the guard. The combs 15 are of undulated or corrugated formation and lead to slots 16 beneath the blade.



http://worldwide.espacenet.com/publi...C=GB&NR=243881

[jamesspo]

Thanks! I'm not seeing much shift or rotation in the cap on yours....maybe a tad, but not nearly as much as Connie's standard. Picture's 4 and 5 (head on shots of the combs) are interesting. Notice in 4, you have a couple of "skinny" teeth (last two teeth on the left), and in 5 the combs are all ground more shallow than the other side. That part in particular looks like hand work to me.

Pics in no particular order btw.........