Taped spines and paddle strops.

**The Mick** · 05-23-2012, 08:02 PM

I live in an RV full time and a paddle strop just fits better then a hanging strop. I recently got a razor that was honed with a taped spine and the paddle just doesn't seem to be doing any good on the edge. The razor is a restored wedge and has a pretty sizable bevel I am just learning to hone and don't want to mess with this razor at this time so I guess a new hanging strop is in order. I'm guessing they work fine on taped razors as they have more give to contact the edge and because I don't hear much about this problem. It's just going to be tight in here for stropping.

**rickboone1** · 05-23-2012, 08:08 PM

Say what??? I'm lost, man.

K, you have more room with a paddle strop.

If your paddle isn't doing any good on the edge it likely needs to be rehoned. How a strop lives (via paddle or a hook) doesn't mean much to the edge itself. The paddle's worked well for your other edges.

What does tape have to do with anything and a strop? Do you strop with tape?

What am I missing here? I understand about more contact with the edge. Meh.... Do stone concave and flex to better meet the edge?

**Legion** · 05-23-2012, 08:12 PM

Normally if the razor was honed with one layer of tape I have not found a need to tape the spine when stropping on a paddle. Being a wedge it might be possible that the razor was honed with more than one layer (I have needed as many as three on true wedges) and this could be giving you the problem.

If a hanging strop is in order you might try hanging it quite high. This will mean you strop more up and down, rather than back and forth, so you will not need so much room. My strop hangs above eye level in my bathroom.

**rickboone1** · 05-23-2012, 08:13 PM

Take the strop outside.

**Kentos** · 05-23-2012, 08:14 PM

Depending on how many layers of tape was used, it is very possible that the edge isn't contacting the leather. Another reason I don't like wedges honed with tape.

**The Mick** · 05-23-2012, 08:24 PM

Originally Posted by rickboone1

Say what??? I'm lost, man.

K, you have more room with a paddle strop.

If your paddle isn't doing any good on the edge it likely needs to be rehoned. How a strop lives (via paddle or a hook) doesn't mean much to the edge itself. The paddle's worked well for your other edges.

What does tape have to do with anything and a strop? Do you strop with tape?

What am I missing here? I understand about more contact with the edge. Meh.... Do stone concave and flex to better meet the edge?

All I'm saying is it seems as if the edge is not contacting the leather on my paddle strop and thought it could be from the tape putting off the geometry of the razor. Just like if you were to rehone a razor that had been taped and you didn't use tape it would not contact the edge of the bevel.

**rickboone1** · 05-23-2012, 08:27 PM

Originally Posted by The Mick

All I'm saying is it seems as if the edge is not contacting the leather on my paddle strop and thought it could be from the tape putting off the geometry of the razor. Just like if you were to rehone a razor that had been taped and you didn't use tape it would not contact the edge of the bevel.

Oh....okay. Sorry. Well...possibly. But, doubtful, IMO. That'd be some thick tape. However, if several layers were used. Yes, I suppose, as mentioned above. Makes sense. A hanging strop may cause to prematurely round out/ convex the edge if it's that far off. Maybe not.

This is why I do not like tape. Well, one of the many many reasons.

Shoot, slap some tape on it and strop. See if the geometry changes enough you notice a difference.

**Kentos** · 05-23-2012, 08:36 PM

Legion, fast on the draw...

**Slash McCoy** · 05-23-2012, 08:51 PM

With a paddle strop, there is zero sag. An ordinary hollowground razor, honed without tape, will strop just fine on a paddle. A wedge or even a near wedge, honed with multiple layers of tape, will require either a couple layers of tape when stropping on the paddle, or a hanging strop.

FWIW when I hone a full wedge, I hone without tape to set the bevel and polish the edge. Only in the finish stage do I tape. This gives a very small secondary bevel, and to a degree this avoids that problem. It is a lot of work initially, but not any more in the long run. Plus, the small secondary bevel shaves better. I gotta say, though... I much prefer hollowgrounds.

In truth, I think the real answer to yoru problem is to get yourself a nice half or quarter hollow blade, hone it properly, and set the wedge aside for now. Hone it without tape, and your paddle strop will work just fine.

**The Mick** · 05-23-2012, 09:01 PM

I have several hollow razors this was my first wedge and first restoration as well it's not a true wedge so I'll ask him how much tape he used I just overlooked that he uses it and didn't request him not to. Nonetheless I loved those first few shaves with it and don't want to put it away for later if a hanging strop will work as I figured it would. I'll just have to get creative in where I put it and it's a good excuse to buy more stuff.

**The Mick** · 05-23-2012, 09:42 PM

Okay so I sat down and really evaluated the contact with the edge ( which I should have done to beguine with ) It's looking more like I'm at fault in my technique with a smile than it being a tape issue. I may have jumped the gun on that theory. I think it being a smile and a paddle I have to do a sort of rolling X as one would do honing. Guess I got some new stropping practice to do. I'll see how the shave goes tomorrow.

**Slash McCoy** · 05-24-2012, 06:16 AM

Even a smiley should get sweet on at least part of the edge when stropping normally.

Do you have a pasted paddle? You might try painting the edge with a sharpie marker and giving it a few dozen laps on the paste. The signature left on the edge should tell you a lot.

**hokahay** · 05-24-2012, 06:34 AM

I know that for Zowada micro bevels, three layers of tape should be used to freshen the edge on balsa just as three layers was used to create the edge.

http://www.tzknives.com/razorcare.html

**The Mick** · 05-24-2012, 07:50 AM

Originally Posted by Slash McCoy

Even a smiley should get sweet on at least part of the edge when stropping normally.

Do you have a pasted paddle? You might try painting the edge with a sharpie marker and giving it a few dozen laps on the paste. The signature left on the edge should tell you a lot.

I have felt with .5 diamond but was wasn't sure if the felt would have enough give to make it inconclusive. Maybe I'll try dry erase marker on one of my other razors and see if it wipes clean then apply to the wedge. I also remembered that I have a nice thick leather belt that I haven't worn in a long time it would make for a good strop so I can give that a try as well. This has to be operator error the honing was done by a very good and well known guy and I've never heard or read anything about this ever being a problem other than when honing. Three new to me aspects tape, wedge and smile for this razor.

**The Mick** · 05-24-2012, 08:58 AM

I have been searching for the letter that was sent with my razor and finally found it as I misplaced it. It says 1 layer of tape and states it does not need tape on any kind of strop. So again It must be my stropping. I'll give the marker a go in a minute to see where I'm missing.

**brother cavefish** · 05-24-2012, 09:09 AM

i really dont think the hone will change the strop usage, hone is hone, and stropping is stropping, i find i Listen to the blade it tells me when its right, i have a real extra hollow razor and it kinda "sings" when stropped- dont apply alot of pressure either- or speed--- no need for tape when stropping, just adjust your hand, you'll feel it

**The Mick** · 05-24-2012, 09:14 AM

Well the dry erase marker worked great right on the leather. All was removed but some at the heal and toe so that I need to work on and maybe I rolled the edge at one point.I didn't even do that when I was starting out but it happens. I guess my original theory was hasty I should have looked at myself first.

**Slash McCoy** · 05-24-2012, 09:48 AM

Well, then the strop is obviously hitting most of the edge, such as it is. If it's not shaving, try your diamond on felt for several dozen laps. If no joy, strop some more on the diamond. I bet you can eventually bring it back to life. Wedges are just ornery and cranky sometimes, which is why I don't normally shave with them.

If you want to try a hanging strop, you could always make a newspaper strop. If you don't have a convenient towel bar, you can use a big D ring. If you don't have a big D ring then a piece of broom handle, dowel, a very long bolt, whatever, and a piece of stout cord tied to both ends and looped over something handy. If it is the flat and relatively unyielding paddle that is giving you the problem, a hanging newspaper strop should show you an improvement after 100 laps or so.

**The Mick** · 05-24-2012, 10:26 AM

I hit the .5 diamond for 24 laps and just really took my time with it and the leather adjusting slightly from heal to toe. Then had a shave. What a difference that really brought it back in line. I wasn't getting horrible shaves before just wasn't seeming to hold the edge and got a little worse each shave. I think I just got too comfortable stropping hollow straight edged razors and just needed to take a little more care in how I was doing it.

Anyway thanks all for helping me in this little bit of overlooking the obvious and jumping to conclusions.