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Those of you who take a multi, what do you use?

^I've been happy with it. I've been taking it for quite a while. that joint support is a very nice bonus:)
 
NOW Nutrition Adam, and I only use it a few times a week as my diet already contains more then enough of all the important nutrients.
 
I have been following this and looking into some vites for at least some extra help in meeting my needs and possibly with getting a least a bump in not getting sick as often . I have gotten hammered with having colds/flu the last couple of months. Does not help having a 19mo child around either but this year has been bad. With that said this is what I have compiled from above for cost and I also added in LEF since I am familiar with them as well. Also note that with LEF you can save more by getting a membership but that only pays off if you buy a lot of things from them.

brandqtypriceprice/pillserving dosehow many days will it lastcost per daystore
Anavite180$ 29.89$ 0.17360$ 0.50bodybuilding.com
Controlled Labs Orange Triad270$ 29.79$ 0.11645$ 0.66bodybuilding.com
AOR Orthocore180$ 45.99$ 0.261180$ 0.26bodybuilding.com
LEF two per day tablets120$ 20.00$ 0.17260$ 0.33lef.org
 
I have been following this and looking into some vites for at least some extra help in meeting my needs and possibly with getting a least a bump in not getting sick as often . I have gotten hammered with having colds/flu the last couple of months. Does not help having a 19mo child around either but this year has been bad. With that said this is what I have compiled from above for cost and I also added in LEF since I am familiar with them as well. Also note that with LEF you can save more by getting a membership but that only pays off if you buy a lot of things from them.

brandqtypriceprice/pillserving dosehow many days will it lastcost per daystore
Anavite180$ 29.89$ 0.17360$ 0.50bodybuilding.com
Controlled Labs Orange Triad270$ 29.79$ 0.11645$ 0.66bodybuilding.com
AOR Orthocore180$ 45.99$ 0.261180$ 0.26bodybuilding.com
LEF two per day tablets120$ 20.00$ 0.17260$ 0.33lef.org


Orthocore is 6 pills per day
 
You are correct. However If you look at the label

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/aor/orthocore.html

they quote what just one pill is and I was basing my calcs on just whatever they listed per serving size. But thanks for catching that detail as people may not realize that 6 may be needed.

The label goes on to say:

"Directions For Ortho-Core: Take up to six capsules daily with meals, or as directed by a qualified health care practitioner. Take a few hours before or after taking other medications."

If you do opt for 6/day then my chart changes that each amount for 180 will last 30 days and the cost per day will be $0.26*6= $1.56.

Also it would only be fair to compare doses per listed serving. That way if you know you want a certain amount you either buy that product or double up or whatever multiple you need.
 
You are correct. However If you look at the label

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/aor/orthocore.html

they quote what just one pill is and I was basing my calcs on just whatever they listed per serving size. But thanks for catching that detail as people may not realize that 6 may be needed.

The label goes on to say:

"Directions For Ortho-Core: Take up to six capsules daily with meals, or as directed by a qualified health care practitioner. Take a few hours before or after taking other medications."

If you do opt for 6/day then my chart changes that each amount for 180 will last 30 days and the cost per day will be $0.26*6= $1.56.

Also it would only be fair to compare doses per listed serving. That way if you know you want a certain amount you either buy that product or double up or whatever multiple you need.


I realize that. I'm going by actives per dose as well, and clearly, not all 4 of these are equal. Anavite is usually recommended at 6x per day to to the Carnosyn
 
Thought I'd post an update. Still feeling good since switching away from Mega Men to OT. I really think the joint complex of OT is helping. Seem to have fewer knee aches. If I could drop 30lbs my knees would probably feel great all the time.

Started the new formulation OT last week. Nice to see the food coloring is out, was a little disappointed at first because of some of the dosage changes, but I'm over it now...and I was hoping they'd get rid of the echinacea.

Still using NOW Ultra Omega 3 (4 per day = 2g EPA and 1g DHA & no fish burps!)...still really hard to find good info on effective dosing of EPA and DHA. I can find good info on tolerable upper intake, but not too much peer reviewed stuff on efficacy and regular maintenance dosing.

Still going with Healthy Origins 30 Billion Probiotics and NOW Magnesium Citrate 1.5 tabs (300mg).

Also switched from another brand to NOW Vitamin D-3 2,000IU (it's cheaper than what I was taking).

I have recently added NOW's Bio-Curcumin Phytosome, as I have been reading more and more about Curcumin in animal nutrition (I work in the animal nutrition field).

I have stopped supplementing Chelated Zinc since OT has a good dose.


If I could just get my fat butt to the gym I'd really be on the right track!
 
I'd like to see some citations or references to scientific studies that compare formulations of whatnot that are involved in the various supplements.

This gogly gok of "This absorbs better than that." without any supporting evidence raises my eyebrows. Who says? What study? How many involved? What were the protocols?

As a physicist, I get used to alot of heavy words being thrown around on a daily basis, but at least I usually get a citation.
 
I'm pretty sure mine are Nature's Way...something like that (all natural). Lab-synthesized chemicals, aka "vitamins", may may not be the best thing for a person's body... just saying... I wouldn't eat meat or veggies that were made in a laboratory/industrial manufacturing plant... ymmv of course lol Obviously no need to worry about it, though, if you ever eat fast food, Doritos, candy bars, or any food that doesn't rot within a week or two being outside the refrigerator. You're already putting loads of crap in. Might as well throw some chemical supplements on top to wash it all down. And then when you don't feel so good, head to the doc for some good ol pharmaceuticals to make you feel better. Really, good luck with that...

You ever notice, once you let a doctor talk you into taking a pill for an ache or a pain or a problem, you never stop taking those pills? She/he just keeps adding to the portfolio. By the time you're 60 years old, you take a shot glass full with every meal. Just saying...
 
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I'm pretty sure mine are Nature's Way...something like that (all natural). Lab-synthesized chemicals, aka "vitamins", may may not be the best thing for a person's body... just saying... I wouldn't eat meat or veggies that were made in a laboratory/industrial manufacturing plant... ymmv of course lol Obviously no need to worry about it, though, if you ever eat fast food, Doritos, candy bars, or any food that doesn't rot within a week or two being outside the refrigerator. You're already putting loads of crap in. Might as well throw some chemical supplements on top to wash it all down. And then when you don't feel so good, head to the doc for some good ol pharmaceuticals to make you feel better. Really, good luck with that...

You ever notice, once you let a doctor talk you into taking a pill for an ache or a pain or a problem, you never stop taking those pills? She/he just keeps adding to the portfolio. By the time you're 60 years old, you take a shot glass full with every meal. Just saying...

FWIW, the label "all natural" is not meaningful by FDA standards. I see my doctor for annual physicals and for any ailment for which I require medical advice which happens maybe once or twice a year. My doctor has not recommended any pharmaceutical regimen for me beyond the occasional antibiotic. If a person finds their doctor to be simply a pill-pusher, then I would suggest that person find a different doctor, and maybe read some online reviews to find the best one to suit their needs.
 
The problem is not good doc/bad doc. The problem is the system. Most people do not realize, and are counter-indoctrinated to the fact, the biggest impact they can have on their own health is from the foods they eat or do not eat. Diet and exercise cures diabetes, but doctors won't admit that. A properly tuned diet can reverse symptoms and totally cure the diseases that we cause ourselves through the abuses we subject our bodies to, including cancer. But you will find exactly zero doctors who will acknowledge that. Most all of them will look at you like you sprouted a second head, or are mentally disabled, if you tell them you cured something naturally. They WILL prescribe you a medication though, once you become ill enough. And they will continue to medicate you, all the way to the grave.

My grandmother cured herself of breast cancer, by ignoring her doctor and going to see an ND. Her cure was dietary. 8 months later she was checked again and the breast tumor was gone. The doctor insisted that the original test was a false positive. Two doctors separately diagnosed it as a malignant tumor and recommended cutting her breast off before she went to the ND. That was over almost 10 years ago, and she gets checked every year, and every year she get the same result. Healthy.

Likewise, I had walking pneumonia for a few weeks last year, which escalated to full on pnuemonia. A lot of my family is comprised of RNs and other medical professionals. My mom in particular strongly urged me to the hospital, saying some things are too serious for natural stuff. Over the next 5 days of bed rest, I pushed a high level of pepper juices, spicy, yellow, and greens, and other dietary modification, and I was right as rain. The doctor told me at my next check up that "I got lucky" and that the food had nothing to do with it.

And the American public is so beholden to the title of "Doctor", and the letters that follow after a learned person's name, they'd rather poison and drug themselves to death at any age (at least in the case of cancer) at the behest of the experts, than take a shot at doing something that actually saves lives, WITHOUT requiring a person to butcher themselves, or pump themselves full of highly toxic poisons (chemo), or subject themselves to unhealthy, tissue destroying amounts of radiation.

And can you tell me you know exactly what that doctor is shooting into your butt or popping down your throat? Do you know if it contains mercury, or petroleum derivatives, or toxic chemicals, or contamination resulting from exposure to toxics during chemical processing? When's the last time you saw an ingredient label on a prescription bottle, or a syringe? The listed chemicals don't add up to 100%. The rest of it could be anything. But you trust the FDA to tell you it's safe. The FDA that has allowed mass production and distribution of many a chemical that's side effect is anything under sun, even up to death. They're admitting that what they're feeding you might kill you, is not at all safe, and you take it anyway. So please spare me "The FDA doesn't find 'all natural' to be a meaningful labeling term." It squarely fall on you, and me, and everyone that's going to put something into their body, to either do so in a haphazard fashion and hope for the best, or research the manufacturer, and the process by which the product is made, and the ingredients in the product, to be sure that it's safe. No one is required to do this, of course. But the Lord says, my body is his temple, and I intend to respect mine to the best of my ability.

Again, YMMV...lol
 
FWIW, the label "all natural" is not meaningful by FDA standards.

But I digress, you are absolutely correct. The term all-natural only means as much as the process behind it. Greenwashing is a problem too, companies profiting by masquerading highly synthesized products that are derived from natural sources, but are in no way natural at the point they mix them into the product. Very true. Hydrogenated oils are a good example of that. Hydrogenated palm kernel oil is one chemical step from being plastic, and causes massive cardio vascular distress (as do all hydrogenated oils), but it sounds natural. They called it palm kernel oil, what's not natural about that? Like I said, research, and a lot of it, is usually needed.
 
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I like your stories, Glenn. I totally agree that knowledge is power, and that modern chemistry has quickly overtaken humankind's knowledge of traditional, food and plant based cures. Here's one of my stories - years ago I was going through a really rough patch. I ended up in a psychiatrist's office who diagnosed me bipolar. I didn't like him and didn't much care for his opinion. Things got worse and I ended up in another psychiatrist's office. I had more faith in this guy, and over time he gave me a diagnosis of bipolar II. We tried several different psych meds (antidepressants, anticonvulsants, antipsychotics), and each one was worse than the last. They either 1) made me worse off than before, 2) made me feel better at first then stopped working, or 3) had terrible side-effects. Finally I told him that I was finished with these meds, no matter what. He told me about a then-recent study by a well-regarded Harvard professor which showed very good results with high doses of fish oil (5-8 grams), in a 2:1 ratio of EPA to DHA in treating my type of disorder. So he worked with me on getting off that other crap and finding a dosage that hit the spot. It's been about six and half years now, and I have been doing great at 2.25 grams total (3 pills)/3x day. Of course regular exercise and a decent diet also contribute. Those psych meds are scary business. The withdrawal from some of those were damn near unbearable - the worst I've ever felt in my life. Who even know what the long-term effects could be of these meds?
 
p.m.a. - Thanks for the kind words. Very glad to hear you're finding what works, I'm happy for you. One of my family members is bipolar, so I at least know what you have to deal with. Also, very surprised to find a mainstream doctor that endorsed a natural remedy. But they are now starting to acknowledge that fish oils are vital for our health. You might also find that sun exposure helps a lot with balancing the mind out. We are creatures evolved in the sun. In the last 50-100 years (much more so in the last 20), we've regressed into our offices and homes, spending less and less time outside. I'm very sensitive to the effects of the sun. A few minutes in the sun lifts my spirits, and I can get pretty bad seasonal depression in the winter. The California central valley gets about 3 months of fog and clouds in the winter a lot of years, and it really doesn't agree with me. About 15 minutes a day in the sun, sans sunscreen, with as much skin exposed as you can get without being arrested, will do a lot of good. The UV, the dreaded UV, reacts with your skins biochemistry to create vitamin D, seratonin, melatonin, and regulates the circadian system. Naturally occurring vitamin D remedies SAD, depression, and boosts immunity, whereas lack of D is linked to a host of disorders including diabetes, heart disease, and allergies. So, it's great that the oils are working, I don't need to tell you to keep it up, but try adding some regular sunshine, not to the extent of sunburn, though.

And you know, as to the meds, it's never occurred to me to be a good thing (I've been on meds for ADD/ADHD as a kid) to take a pill that will totally alter your mind set. It's re-wiring your brain. It can't be good to screw around up there too much. Chantix, the smoking cessation pill, is case in point. Why do we not approve of heroine, cocaine, PCP, acid, LSD, binge drinking, and general substance abuse, as a society? But we fully endorse altering your mind with a chemical under the label of modern medicine... Not to mention, a lot of our illegal substances today found their start as a pharmaceutical...

Granted no one can argue that a psychotic needs intervention by whatever means necessary. But our hyperactive children, PPD mothers, bipolar cousins, and chronically depressed teenagers don't need pills, they need lifestyle modification.
 
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You ever notice, once you let a doctor talk you into taking a pill for an ache or a pain or a problem, you never stop taking those pills? She/he just keeps adding to the portfolio. By the time you're 60 years old, you take a shot glass full with every meal. Just saying...

Without the benefits of those evil medicines, the likelihood of you reaching 60 yrs is very small. Just saying. And it's not because of the evil crap in the food. Go back and look at the life expectancy 100 yrs ago. Just saying...
 
Without the benefits of those evil medicines, the likelihood of you reaching 60 yrs is very small. Just saying. And it's not because of the evil crap in the food. Go back and look at the life expectancy 100 yrs ago. Just saying...

My great great great uncle John Shell live to be somewhere between 128 and 132. He was so old when he died, no one knew exactly when he was born. He outlived 8 wives. He outlived all but two of his children, which were many, I don't remember how many exactly. I have a newspaper clipping in safe keeping that shows him, the year before his death, sitting in a chair with his two youngest sons standing at his sides. They were in their 70s and 80s. The most medical attention he ever had was pulled teeth at a dentist that operated out of a covered wagon. His secret to longevity was, according to him, he drank 8 glasses of water a day, without fail. He raised his own food, never knew what a McDonald's was, and lived out his days on a farm in rural Kentucky.

But you are probably right. Eating fast food, processed food, preserved food, completely artificial food, nutritionally value-less food; and even for those of us eating only whole foods from the grocery that are raised unnaturally and produce that’s harvested while still green, we're not getting the full nutritional value that nature intended. We probably will be lucky to make it to 60. The ones eating whole foods will make a good 70 years before death. But then figure in overeating and a sedentary lifestyle, that takes it down another 10 or 20 years. In fact you're absolutely correct. A good 95% of the country will need chemical support in order to stave off death because they refuse to live a healthy lifestyle.

And life expectancy 100 years ago was affected heavily by the limited availability of local nutrition; lack of infrastructure to distribute a variety of foods to various places; lack of knowledge about parasites and clean water, cooking food properly, not eating rotted/tainted food; poor hygiene; inadequacy of clothing and shelter to protect from the elements; inability of a family to generate enough income to properly support a family; and generally people working themselves to death. OSHA came about only in the 20th century. Before that, people would expose themselves to any number of extremely hazardous work environments, and work inhumanly long hours, just to put food on the table. And the money they earned, by and large, was not enough to accomplish that in any effective way. In short, society was killing people. There are volumes and volumes of history books written by credible authors citing credible sources that detail exactly how hard life could be in centuries past.

We have insulated homes, with central heating and air, running water, clean water; regulated work schedules and work environments; incredible potential for education; and huge economic resources at our disposal through our own income and social programs. The only reason we don’t live past 60 without meds is our own life choices.
 
I'd like to see some citations or references to scientific studies that compare formulations of whatnot that are involved in the various supplements.

This gogly gok of "This absorbs better than that." without any supporting evidence raises my eyebrows. Who says? What study? How many involved? What were the protocols?

As a physicist, I get used to alot of heavy words being thrown around on a daily basis, but at least I usually get a citation.

Without the benefits of those evil medicines, the likelihood of you reaching 60 yrs is very small. Just saying. And it's not because of the evil crap in the food. Go back and look at the life expectancy 100 yrs ago. Just saying...

We're having a friendly conversation here, not positing the next global health fad. I don't think it's constructive or particularly brotherly to come in and wag a finger, mumble "gogly gok", and call us out for not citing our posts. B&B isn't The Lancet, I'm pretty sure we all know that. There's an ocean of peer reviewed work on the subject of supplementation, supplement forms, and bioavailability. The abstracts are readily available to those who seek them.

Skepticism is essential. I appreciate skepticism (as well as the points you make), but it doesn't have to come at the expense of civility.


Anyone join me in getting this thread back on topic?
 
I'm actually with you there. I kept telling myself I wouldn't respond to any other comments, but kept on anyway. Apologies all, getting back on track...
 
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