Question about Maestro Livi razors

Ok, no disrespect meant to anyone here, but I'm genuinely curious. What's the big deal about these razors? What is it about them that commands such a high price? They seem to enjoy almost mythical status around here, and they're cool, but I'm trying to understand what is the big hub-bub about them?

I saw a 12/8 in boxwood scales that looked pretty run of the mill. Basic spine work with some x's carved into the spine, and it's like €1400.

Again, I'm not trying to down on Maesto Livi or anyone who owns one of these razors, I'm just trying to come to grips with the fact that they're obviously very desirable/collectable, yet for me they evoke almost zero emotion in me when I see one.

I have several Livi razors and here is my take...

First off there are two different Livi razors

1) Livi regrinds, which were old blanks that he reground and put scales on. Depending on the market they range at about $300 US
2) Livi originals

Now these are cut from steel by him and produced start to finish by Livi. These can run from $600-1500 depending on the type of steel and scale material. They are nice razors, but in all honesty they are probably way overpriced. In all honesty, I think most straight razors today are a tad expensive in the "custom" realm. Im sure you will see the general statement of "a dovo will shave just as well" but then again, these are usually one of a kind razors. I do have to say that for the price point, they could be finished a bit better than they are. I have razors that still have grinding marks on the blade, and then patterned damascus has hone wear straight from the factory. Livi probably is not as neurotic with blades as we are, such as using tape, but when your dropping a couple of hundred you would want the blade to be perfect.

That is just my .02

I think it all boils down to YMMV. They evoke zero emotion in you, apparently others have a different aesthetic. I personally tend to agree with you on this one - they don't really move me like, say, Bill Ellis' creations do, but again, to each his own. From everything I've heard, Mastro Livi makes a fantastic razor, which I would certainly expect, and I would imagine that reputation plays a big part in the pricing of his work. But the value of an item is what someone is willing to pay for it, and guys line up for his stuff so there must be something to it. If I had that kind of money to spend on shave gear, though, (which I certainly don't) there are other artisans out there whose creations are more inspiring to me.

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I also think that most 'custom' razors are overpriced - from the point of view of the shave. This is one of those instances where the price of an object will be set by what the market will bear.

There are some really phenomenal blade designers - Bill Ellis, Alex Jacques, and others. However, I also really appreciate the simple lines of a Tim Zowada razor. There's a TZ razor available on Classic for something like $2600. Is it going to shave any better than your run of the mill TI? Probably not. However, that razor was made by steel smelted from sand by Tim Zowada -- that has value beyond its performance. These gentlemen put in an amazing amount of work into their creations, and they have a right to charge what they think their razors are worth.

Back to Livi razors: In the custom razor world, you see a lot of wedges and 1/4 hollow grinds - since most people don't have access to a double grinder like they used to have in the old days (and like Dovo and TI still have). Apparently, Livi can grind a blade to almost full-hollowness with a single grinder ---- that's art, my friends! To me, a hollow-ground custom is worth a lot of money.

I have a Livi (a recent acquisition). It is a beautiful razor (to me), that has a grind I love, and that shaves well. So, to me it is worth what I gave up for it. The fact that I can get as good a shave from a $20 Torrey is neither here nor there. I appreciate the art in my simple Torrey, and I appreciate the art in the Livi too.

And there you sorta answered most of my question... So he grinds a razor old school does it all by hand, etc. I can respect that, and I can appreciate why his razors are sought after and expensive. That said, the old adage "I don't know anything about art, but I know what I hate" applies here as it does everywhere, and that said, his razors do nothing for me aesthetically speaking, so I'll likely never seek to own one (and that's my problem to reconcile, not a blanket statement that his razors are ugly, which wouldn't be true).

Don't get me wrong, if I had the money, I'd certainly be rocking out some customs. I just see that there's a big perceived aesthetic difference between a Livi and just about everyone elses razors, so I wanted to reconcile that...

I've got 3 Livi's. I don't buy them because the quality of the shave is that much better than say a nice Le Grelot, I buy them because they are hand made pieces of art that will also give you a great shave. It's the same with all custom razors.
A Ferrari is just a car. It gets you from A to B, just like a Kia. Why do people buy a Ferrari when the Kia is probably a lot more practical?

johnmrson said:

I've got 3 Livi's. I don't buy them because the quality of the shave is that much better than say a nice Le Grelot, I buy them because they are hand made pieces of art that will also give you a great shave. It's the same with all custom razors.
A Ferrari is just a car. It gets you from A to B, just like a Kia. Why do people buy a Ferrari when the Kia is probably a lot more practical?

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I have to agree with that. There is something in my opinion about his razors that look wonderful. I currently have 4 and they are stunning to look at.

Can we see these Livis?

johnmrson said:

I've got 3 Livi's. I don't buy them because the quality of the shave is that much better than say a nice Le Grelot, I buy them because they are hand made pieces of art that will also give you a great shave. It's the same with all custom razors.
A Ferrari is just a car. It gets you from A to B, just like a Kia. Why do people buy a Ferrari when the Kia is probably a lot more practical?

Click to expand...

Just for the record, a Ferrari does things a Kia simply can not do

johnmrson said:

I've got 3 Livi's.

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Pics are needed.

MajorBurnz said:

Back to Livi razors: In the custom razor world, you see a lot of wedges and 1/4 hollow grinds - since most people don't have access to a double grinder like they used to have in the old days (and like Dovo and TI still have). Apparently, Livi can grind a blade to almost full-hollowness with a single grinder ---- that's art, my friends! To me, a hollow-ground custom is worth a lot of money.
.

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Yohann,
I may be wrong on this but I'm think I have read Livi is one of the few that does have a vintage double grinder.
I'll do some looking.


IsaacRN, great looking Razors

I'll take some pics when I get home from work tonight.

RazoRock said:

Just for the record, a Ferrari does things a Kia simply can not do

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Likewise, there are some things a Kia does that a Ferrari simply can not do.

Ever try to take a family of 3 and a few suitcases from LA to New York in a Ferrari?
Ever park a Ferrari at the LAX parking lot and go on a week vacation? The Kia will still be there when you return

A Ferrari is like a custom chopper. It's simply awesome, and a fun vehicle for a weekend day trip (or bar hopping in the case of the chopper)... but both are terribly impractical as daily transportation.

RazoRock said:

Just for the record, a Ferrari does things a Kia simply can not do

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It goes both ways too... Every try to put three kids a dog and a load of groceries in a Ferrari?


[MORON]Yeah, OK, I should really read ALL the responses before I decide to try to post a witty retort...[/MORON]

johnmrson said:

I've got 3 Livi's. I don't buy them because the quality of the shave is that much better than say a nice Le Grelot, I buy them because they are hand made pieces of art that will also give you a great shave. It's the same with all custom razors.
A Ferrari is just a car. It gets you from A to B, just like a Kia. Why do people buy a Ferrari when the Kia is probably a lot more practical?

Click to expand...

I only have one but I enjoy it quite a bit. It's a 7/8 stainless with a darkened finish in olive wood. The grind, as mentioned, is almost hollow but with less flex. Takes and holds a great edge. I've been thinking about getting another.

cb91710 said:

Likewise, there are some things a Kia does that a Ferrari simply can not do.

Ever try to take a family of 3 and a few suitcases from LA to New York in a Ferrari?
Ever park a Ferrari at the LAX parking lot and go on a week vacation? The Kia will still be there when you return

A Ferrari is like a custom chopper. It's simply awesome, and a fun vehicle for a weekend day trip (or bar hopping in the case of the chopper)... but both are terribly impractical as daily transportation.

Click to expand...

If you need a Ferrari to do that, then you get a Maserati QP, with the 430 Ferrari motor

Here's my three.

MileMarker60 said:

Yohann,
I may be wrong on this but I'm think I have read Livi is one of the few that does have a vintage double grinder.
I'll do some looking.


IsaacRN, great looking Razors

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Brian -

You could easily be right. I don't have the first clue about how he does this. Someone mentioned in another thread that he freehands the grind on a single grinder, but I have no evidence to confirm that.

Here's a bad pic of my lovely razor:



Shaved with it this morning, and the shave was excellent - close, comfortable, and just an all-round pleasure. It's certainly one of the best shavers I have, which is surprising, as I usually only like 5/8" razors (this one's over 7/8" wide).