Wanna get this right

beengone said:

Im doing a lot of loading- all the way until I start getting actual lather on the soap.
The brush is a finest restored. I'm going to use my pure next time. I like the finest, but have never had as good of luck with lather. What are your thoughts?

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My thoughts are that the brush is not the problem. 95% of the time I'm using a restored brush with a finest badger knot and don't have any issues with lathering. I would still encourage you to use more product.

What about your water? Do you know if it's exceptionally hard/high in mineral content? If so, you can try using distilled water (available inexpensively from grocery or drug stores) and see if that makes a difference.

Again, I appreciate all your help. I PMed you a lot more info and some questions. If you don't get it, please let me know. I agree that the brush shouldn't be the problem here. I have pretty good city water. I'll try to pick up some distilled anyway, but I think the problem is some sort of user error. Always the tools, you know?

beengone said:

Again, I appreciate all your help. I PMed you a lot more info and some questions. If you don't get it, please let me know. I agree that the brush shouldn't be the problem here. I have pretty good city water. I'll try to pick up some distilled anyway, but I think the problem is some sort of user error. Always the tools, you know?

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a poor carpenter blames his tools, yo!

Don't know if you saw this thread/video, but I've been wet/DE shaving since September and have always had enough lather to get though my 3 passes, but it was hardly ever luxurious. I watched this video a few days ago, followed it to a "T", and had mounds of lather! So far I've tried it with five different soaps, and it doesn't fail! At first, you think to yourself that you have about three times too much water in it - but then the magic happens... Watch the video in post # 1:
http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...ll-s-Wool-Fat-aka-MWF-Shave-Soap-Lather-Video
Good luck!

Day 2 on feather, 40 hours growth. Wanted to skip it for the entire day and let my face heal, but had to shave tonight. Water sat on the soap for a while and I loaded my brush ~1 minute and moved to the other bowl. I got lather that would hold a peak, but it was dry and sticky. A few more drops gave me a slippery lather that peaked, but couldn't hold a peak. I used this and it dried out very quickly on my face and didn't create any volume in the bowl. I played with it for a while, adding soap and water but still no luck. So I just lathered small parts of my face at a time.

Again, I'll try distilled water and see what happens.

The shave was pretty irritating and I think it was because I tried to brush in some water and was still a tiny bit irritated from the past shave. I expected major irritation and had some, but it cleared up in a few hours and was actually a DFS on all buy my lower neck where I did only two passes.

I woke up this morning and tried lathering again, this time starting with VERY little water. May have been a touch better, but still couldn't get any volume of lather, just a tiny bit.

Update on the Palmolive. I grabbed some distilled water and had to run home for a while during lunch. I had enough time to test lather a bit. I used my pure brush soaked in the distilled water for a while and let some water sit on the soap in my bowl. Shook out the brush better than normal, dumped the extra water off the soap and swirled it 60 times. I then moved to my bowl and swirled for a while. I did get a thicker lather that held peaks, but not a ton of it - just enough for about 2-3 passes probably. I spread it no the back of my hand and let it set for a while to see it it would dry out. I don't know that I left it long enough, but it didn't seem to dry out. It was very slick with lots of cushion and did go on thicker than what I've had lately. I didn't try the razor, but it felt like it might be too thick and could gum up, but I can't be sure.

Happy with that - I'll try it when I shave next - I added a few drops of water to see what would happen. Quickly my peaks wouldn't hold and it became a little thin to where it wouldn't apply in any real thickness.

So, next shave - tomorrow if all goes well - I'll mix it a little drier with the distilled water and see what happens.

I also grated more of the stick into my bowl as I was starting to see the bottom in the center. I have a bit of it in a travel tube, probably 1/4-1/3, and have about 1/4" above the top of the green holder of the stick as well as maybe 1/4" in my Pyrex 1-cup bowl. Seems like this soap would lather about 20 times or so before the stick ran out. Does that sound right?

TonyBrown said:

a poor carpenter blames his tools, yo!

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Exactly what I was getting at. I realize the inflection wasn't quite there (dang text) in the original. I didn't have any typos, but it could be easy to overlook or miss the sarcasm. Glad you're following along and hope this becomes informative.

beengone said:

Exactly what I was getting at. I realize the inflection wasn't quite there (dang text) in the original. I didn't have any typos, but it could be easy to overlook or miss the sarcasm. Glad you're following along and hope this becomes informative.

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oh, it already has... I haven't gone into such detail on my thread but have been trying to provide at least regular updates to it as well (inspired by this thread).

Day 3 on Feather. Tried that Palmolive again today with same results. I only lathered half my face at a time so I didn't have to worry about it drying out as much. I spread it on thicker, but it's sticky and gummy. I added a bit more water and it became sort of runny. I'm giving up on the Palmolive for now. Is it possible I got a bum stick? Seems unlikely, but I have no trouble like this with my other soaps or cream. Didn't do any ATG today as I need to shave again tomorrow and didn't dare without good lather. I had to do two XTGs after my WTG as they just weren't cutting close, likely due to the lather.

34 minutes and ended up a SAS. Two bleeders that stopped between passes. One was on my WTG - not sure how that happened.

Through the last two days I received some PIF blades from bcs89 and jtb- Wilkinsons, Lords, Rapiras, Med Prep - as well as the cream/soap sampler I traded xraydoc consisting of sample sizes of DR Harris Marlborough, Trumpers coconut, TOBS avocado, either Spiek or Musgo Real (it's a greenish color, can someone tell me which it is, please?), a stick of Arko, and a puck of Real Shaving Co bay rum. This was all in trade for a soap and bowl of TOBS sandalwood and I appreciate VERY much his trading all that with me - I got the better end of the deal for certain. I'll go through the different products as I use them as well as the blades. Thanks again to all of you.

My initial thoughts are:

- Arko is quite the scent. Smells like a soapy, lemony Pine Sol. Not so sure I'm keen on it, but will try it sometime.
- TOBS Avocado has a soft, interesting scent, but I think it's a little too flowery for me.
- Trumper coconut is very sweet smelling. I'm not a coconut fan, but look forward to trying another of the three Ts.
- DR Harris marlborough - not sure yet. Didn't seem to have a strong scent and didn't make any impression either way.
- Musgo Real / Speick - really curious which this is. I think I like the scent of this the best of all these.
- Real Shaving Co bay rum - I like the smell of this, but not sure how much. I look forward to trying it out to see how the lather is.

Again, thank you bcs98, jtb, and xraydoc

24 hours growth. Had to decide to shave after work today or get a GREAT shave this morning as we're going out for our anniversary tonight. Opted to gamble on a great shave this morning.


Shave
Normal prep. DE89 with a Rapira Platinum Lux (then Feather), TOBS sandalwood cream, "finest" brush.

I added some cream directly to my face as normal and noticed it's drying out a little faster than it used to. I think the air is just so much drier now that it's winter I'll have to turn off the fan in our bathroom while I shave. This is likely part of the problem I had with the Palmolive. Whipped up some lather with my TOBS cream instead of the Palmolive today. It lathered better that the Palmolive, though not as slick. I did not add glycerin. Lathered up and started a WTB pass with the Rapira Platinum Lux. It drug and tugged on my sideburn/cheek area. I re-checked my lather and blade angle and tried the other side with same results. Binned that blade and loaded a Feather. (wanted to try another new blade, but needed to get to work sooner than later)

WTG, XTG, ATG, touch-ups with some blade buffing. I did mess up once on my neck and got a little blood, but not much and was on my touch-ups. I did a quick styptic between my warm and cold rinse, WH, Nivea arctic freeze and done. The Nivea burned just a touch where I cut myself and one small area on the other side of my neck.


Outcome and Time
I was well-rewarded with a comfortable 85% BBS, 15% DFS shave. VERY happy. Didn't time.


Takeaways
- Rapira Plat. Lux isn't for me, at least in an DE89.
- Not sure what to think about the Palmolive. I feel like it's more slippery and has better cushion, but I can't get a good lather out of it. The TOBS gives me fantastic shaves in just three passes with the same razor and blade.


Questions
- Any thoughts on the mystery cream? It's greenish and is either Speick or Musgo Real. xraydoc thought someone would know right away which it is by color.

beengone said:

Questions
- Any thoughts on the mystery cream? It's greenish and is either Speick or Musgo Real. xraydoc thought someone would know right away which it is by color.

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I've got some Speick cream and it's a very pale pink color. You must have the Musgo Real.

Snargle said:

I've got some Speick cream and it's a very pale pink color. You must have the Musgo Real.

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Perfect. Figured it would be a simple answer for someone in the know.

I'm still having the same lather problems with any soap or cream I try. I think I've been adding too much water later and over-stirring it. I'm still not getting a great volume and it tends to dry both on my face and in the bowl. Posted in the Newbie forum as separate thread. Today gave me a great half-pass and then I had to add water to my face. Second half-pass was good again, but all went downhill from there. I'm going to double the amount of cream I use in hopes a greater volume will dry out less quickly. Adding any more water just makes it running and not slippery.

Used some of my Musgo Real cream sample from xraydoc today. It seemed very similar to my TOBS for cushion and slickness and the scent is fine. I have probably 3-4 more uses of it left and will give it a go again in the future. I like it, but not any better than my TOBS sandalwood.

Just received a fantastic PIF brush from Snargle - a Frank Shaving with finest knot. And he sent a stand as well. So many of you have helped in so many ways and make this place great. Blessings on everyone aiding others.

48 hours of growth after the last butchering. It was day 2 on my Feather (though I think it faded on shave 2 due to the bad lather to which I subjected it a couple days ago). After cleaning and testing my brushes and seemingly being unable to make poor lather, I chose to go all-out today: Face lather with Palmolive. I haven't been able to do either of those with success yet. Trying together was a bold move, but I was confident. And well-rewarded.

Shave
I used the Frank Shaving Finest brush (another tip-o-the-hat to snargle) and my Palmolive that I grated into a bowl. And I face lathered. Amazing lather and no badger burn. I started a little dry and added water as I needed. The lather was perfect and never dried out; it was as slick and smooth as I could ask for.

The shave itself started so much better. The WTG pass removed far more than when I was using bad lather. This pass was just like it used to be a couple weeks ago when I was getting good lather. XTG followed suit. I did a few XTG touch-ups and moved to ATG. I should have done a second XTG on my neck, leaving ATG for the face only. I had a few small weepers on my neck during the ATG and touch-ups, two of which demanded a styptic. But, that was due to my rushing on my neck including a little bit of poor angle. Again, I should have stuck with XTG on my neck for today.

Outcome and Time
DFS on all but around the AA on my neck. DFS+ everywhere else. Little burn from my Nivea Arctic Freeze on my neck where I messed up.
I'll get back to timing when I get a few consistent latherings and shaves.

Takeaways
- I need to see if my old brushes work this much better now that they're clean. Neither the FS or Conk brush shed water when first dipped like the Conk was doing before the cleaning. Posted here to get more info on that.
- Palmolive is amazing.
- This FS Finest brush is superb for face lathering and works VERY well with the Palmolive
- I'm free to start trying other combos and new items so long as I keep getting good lather.
- Going to get a container of alcohol set aside to see if I can extend blade life.
- Any time I notice water just rolling off my brush as if it's been oiled, I need to clean it.

Glad the Frank Shaving brush is working out well! And isn't that Palmolive soap fantastic stuff? I've always maintained that if they sold it in puck form, added a fancy scent, gave it some exotic name, and packaged it in a fancy wooden bowl, they could be selling the stuff for $50 and people would be lined up to special-order it!

You both have me wanting to try the Palmolive soap now.

Snargle said:

Glad the Frank Shaving brush is working out well! And isn't that Palmolive soap fantastic stuff? I've always maintained that if they sold it in puck form, added a fancy scent, gave it some exotic name, and packaged it in a fancy wooden bowl, they could be selling the stuff for $50 and people would be lined up to special-order it!

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donoma said:

You both have me wanting to try the Palmolive soap now.

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Do it. At the cost, you can't beat it. I have a stick of Arko I'm trying to get myself motivated to try out as I hear it's also a lather bomb. Sadly, the scent has me standing far away from it. I don't dislike the palmolive at all, but don't want to stick my nose next to it either. With my TOBS sandalwood, I want to crack the lid and give a whiff every now-and-then.

Totally agree that if Palmolive added a better scent, they could charge about anything. This is going to be my travel stick and I'm going to perfect using it directly on my face. I look forward to traveling with just the razor, some blades, a brush (I'll probably work on saving for a small travel brush sometime, but can use this FS for now), and this stick. It's certainly going to be stocked in my cabinet at all times, even if not in heavy rotation.

More tests to be sure the brush cleaning solved my lather problems. Spoiler: It did. Conk pure brush bowl lathered the Palmolive perfectly. If only it came in better scents, I'd be tempted to buy only that stuff. Palmolive soap that smells like my TOBS sandalwood cream would be it for me.

I switched out my razor today. I've been itching to try new creams and soaps, my other razor, and my other blades. Confident I had my lather problems solved, I went ahead and grabbed my 1980 SS. I didn't want to do ATG today, especially with a new razor. So, I popped in an Astra SP.

The SS is way lighter than my EJ DE89. I had to apply some pressure so it was about like my DE89 for it to cut well. I also noticed it's WAY more mild than the DE89. People talk about the DE89 being a mild shaver, but I've seen that chart with measurements and now I've seen a blade in the SS and they're very different with the DE89 being noticeably more aggressive. The doors opened up on me just a touch by the end and I had to tighten them down again. Blade didn't wobble though.

The shave was pretty close for WTG, XTG, XTG and some ATG in a few areas just to see how it worked. I have to rinse this razor far more often. As expected, there's no way I can go ATG with these blades in dense areas and even XTG tugged a bit. It was very similar to how the Astra SPs work in the DE89. I look forward to trying it with a Feather in the near future - maybe tomorrow or Sunday. This razor was very forgiving and I was able to move much more quickly along than with my EJ. Again, I look forward to trying a Feather and did have to use pressure with my Astras to keep it on my face.