DE shave #2 (Long time listener first time caller) - questions at the end.

Well after much lurking here at Badger & Blade doing my research (Google+Forum=instant expert) I ordered a Merkur HD barber pole last week.

I was sick of spending big bucks on mach 3 and having them last maybe 3 shaves (MAN WITH A SERIOUS BEARD HERE! My partner says I remind her of The Simpson's ep where Homer shaves and it grows right back before he steps away from the mirror) so...

...the Merkur arrived, I put a Gillette 7 o'clock blade in and lathered with Gillette Shaving Gel (chose not to lash out on a brush and shaving soap as I have a nearly full can and part of this was about actually saving money and resources so it seemed wasteful not to use it).

Things went slowly...very very slowly. It took like 25 minutes to shave but I made it through without a scratch and it was a pretty damned fine first effort. The blade and the razor was a very different feel for a very experienced 41 year old shaver. I thought perhaps years of shaving meant my technique wasn't too bad.

I went the witch hazel afterwards and was pretty pleased with my efforts for DE #1. Another day spent lurking on this site and I thought I'd whip out in my lunch hour and grab a BodyShop synthetic brush ($17 - a good cheap start I thought) and some soap - I got the Crabtree and Evelyn Sandalwood in a slick wooden bowl.

So this morning I crack the soap and brush and lather up according to the handy tips from this here forum...

OH. MY. GOD. The difference between a shaving soap and the foam or gel I've been using for years was astounding. Just a mindblowing lather and a completely different feel to any shaving experience I'd ever had. Where have you been all my life?

I suspect that the awesomeness of the lather made it easier for me to press too hard as I have some slightly stinging skin still - a few hours after DE #2 but again, no cuts or nicks and wow - shaving soap and a brush FTW! However it still took a really slow and cautious 15+ minutes to get there.

So why did we ever move to foam in a can? I might have to go the Mach3 for speed shaving now and again but I wouldn't ever go back to foam after this brush and soap.

And now the questions
1: Can any experienced DE shavers give me an idea of how fast they manage to lather and shave? And how many shaves/years did this take to achieve?
2: So what's with the stinging? Witchazel and moisturiser did nothing to relieve this and it lasted/is lasting a long time.

from what you're saying, it sounds like the second shave was actually worse. perhaps the scent of the soap and the luxury of brushing made the overall experience better? my guess would be that the lather you made was not thick or sufficient in cushion--you say yourself it "made it easier for me to press too hard". if you got a great lather on your first try, you are a true genius of shaving ;-) that said, maybe you did and the excitement of the whole experience made you apply pressure. there should never be any pressure, now matter how confident you feel.


v.

Welcome to B&B!

1. Everyone is different, so there is no "set time" it should take you. With that being said, it just depends. Some people use minimal shave prep allowing for a faster shave, while others do the whole 9 yards. Just boils down to how long you need to achieve what YOU want. I guess it can take me 10-20 minutes depending on what I am doing, how much time I have, and etc.

2. Make sure your using "0" pressure while shaving. Sometimes it seems as if we use no pressure but the results tell us otherwise. Just keep on practicing technique and enjoy it!

Hope this helps a little bit!



Tweety

Yes that's possible - I think it was so sumptuous and so very different from a puffy foam or a greasy gel that it made it more enjoyable but yeah it was a worse shave at least in terms of after-effects. I will work up more lather next time, perhaps because I've read so much about how hard it can be to lather up that I was pleased with how easy it was... Perhaps long way off what it should have been.

Ahh well - more tomorrow. Or maybe Saturday because I reckon this shave will last 2 days.

Like you, the cost of carts became an issue for me, so here I am. Also like you I was looking for a simple, minimum time, minimum fuss shave that was still enjoyable. It can be done. Some random thoughts.

- There is no getting around the learning curve, so don't try to rush it
- No need to jump right into high end products and ebay auctions, etc., save that until you've mastered your technique and you're sure this is for you
- Map your face so you really know what direction is WTG/XTG/ATG. This was perhaps the key for me in getting quick, smooth, no/low irritation shaves because it is the basic info needed to know how to get close without overdoing it
- Control your variables. Unless a blade clearly doesn't work, go through 2 or 3 before trying the next. Find a basic, good quality soap or cream and stick with it through the learning process. Same with razor and brush. You would use this same approach in learning some other manual skill, right?
- Read up, watch the videos (Mantic and others), but focus on basics. Some of what you come across will be what works for only one person and an awful lot of it will be just silly--that is if your goal is a simple, no-fuss, enjoyable shave (sorry guys, understand YMMV and all that), so read and absorb but with a grain of salt and common sense. But with this caveat in mind, there is a lot of good advice around here and elsewhere on the net.
- personal advice--if you want this thing to work for you, treat like other changes that you've made work for you. Stick with it, put the M3 away for about 6 weeks or more and commit your mind and hand to at least get to the point where you can get good consistent shaves. At that point, when you really know you can do it, then you can decide what you want to do based on what you like, not on perceived difficulties or issues you can eventually overcome (e.g., neck irritation). By the way, I'm not a M3 or Gillette/Schick hater, I just won't pay that price anymore and know I have an alternative that gets the job done as well and as fast.
- You may love all this stuff and become the ultimate hobbyist; but for now, the mastery phase, I recommend sticking doggedly to your goal of being able to get no fuss, consistent and enjoyable good shaves and don't get distracted with products, methods, gimmicks, and stuff--plenty of time for that after you master the one razor/brush/blade/soap in your hand now

Lots of great advice and suggestions above!

Egmont wrote a fine small overture above. I'll choose one theme of his I haven't heard much here before:

- personal advice--if you want this thing to work for you, treat like other changes that you've made work for you. Stick with it, put the M3 away for about 6 weeks or more and commit your mind and hand to at least get to the point where you can get good consistent shaves. At that point, when you really know you can do it, then you can decide what you want to do based on what you like, not on perceived difficulties or issues you can eventually overcome (e.g., neck irritation). By the way, I'm not a M3 or Gillette/Schick hater, I just won't pay that price anymore and know I have an alternative that gets the job done as well and as fast.

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+1 ... Bravo! So just dive in, get wet, and get enough experience to make your decision based on what is working for you.

My answers to your questions are these:

1. I can lather and shave with a three pass shave in 10-12 minutes, if I do it at a clip. How long did it take to learn. Dang, I don't know I've been at it for a long time.

2. Too much pressure will always produce irritation. Your increased sensitivity to the razor and blade will give you less irritation and closer shaves. Going for irritation free shaves and being sensitive to razor angle and pressure will increase your skills fairly quickly.

Welcome Aboard!! Lot's of great advice already given.

Welcome to B&B! Every shave is a learning experience.

Welcome to B&B!

Welcome to B&B.

Welcome to B&B!

Much good advice above. I would reiterate the importance of 'no pressure'. I also agree with the hunch that your lather might not have been up to the task.

The B&B Shave Wiki has much excellent information, http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/Category:Latheri

Additionally, Mantic59 has some great, informative videos, http://mantic59.blogspot.com/p/essential-videos.html. Of particular interest for you may be entitled, "The Ten Minute Traditional Wetshave".

If you think about it, men shaved for generations double edge razors. For those of us who grew up using cartridges, we need to 'relearn' how to shave. This takes time, but is well worth the effort.

Good Luck, Enjoy and keep us posted on your progress.

First, welcome to B&B.

You have some good advice, above.

DE shaving is different from cartridge shaving in that you must be sure you are not putting any pressure on the blade. Let the weight of the razor do the work for you. To assure this I use two fingers and my thumb to hold the razor with another finger resting on the tip of the handle. This results in holding the razor very lightly with no pressure on the razor. You want to hold the razor as lightly as you can without it falling from your hand. And here is a good post that will help you on blade angle.

I use Uberlather http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/Uberlather
technique by combining soap and cream with a few drops of glycerin to the lather to assure a smooth, irritation-free shave. Since using uberlather, I have consistently gotten better shaves with no irritation. However, even with this lather NO PRESSURE and blade angle are vital.

What you do after you shave also is important.

First, I take any remaining uberlather cream from my shaving mug and gently massage it onto my face and neck. The lather which contains glycerin is very soothing. I then rinse my face with warm water to take off the lather. Next, I soak a wash cloth in cold water and put in on my face for about 30 seconds. Next I apply a splash of Thayers Rose Petal or Lavender WH. Both are alcohol free and do not sting when going on but provide soothing relief to my skin. I then use a skin moisturizer or ASB to provide relief. There are a number of good products out there such as Nivea, Neutrogena, T&H, GFT, and others. Another good one that is not meant only for shaving but does an excellent job is CeraVe Facial Moisturizing Lotion. Also, at night I put on a moisturizer – usually CeraVe – and that hastens the healing process and prepares my face for the next day’s shave. If my face is really raw I use a moisturizer I borrow from my wife.

Welcome, and great job on your first two shaves without needing a blood infusion!

Great advice above... I would add that the burn you feel could be from the soap. I got some Sandalwood cream that burnt my face. Do a test lather on the inside of your wrist or elbow. I got a red irritated area when I did it after a recommendation on the forum here. I have also found almond oil gives me a little irritation(but I still endure Cella though).

Huh... I'll try the sandalwood on my wrist tonight. Hadn't thought my skin was allergic to anything. That would be a crying shame if it was, I can't recommend that shave soap highly enough - that was just delicious! So very different to anything out of a can.

I'm going to leave it to the seasoned wet shavers here to give you answers to your questions. They've helped me tremendously.
But I just wanted to add that I found that while a quicker shave is sometimes needed, I suggest you take your time and enjoy the ride. With that you will get a better shave and some real you time. Both have the same value to me. I now get up for work a half hour early to get out of the shower, set up my shaving gear and proceed to enjoy my 20 minutes. Or, if I have time I turn it into 30 minutes. Quality time I too often don't get anywhere else in my day.

Welcome to B & B.

Welcome to B&B

:-( I wish I had an extra a 30 minutes in the morning. Gym at 6am, home a bit before 7am, kicked out of bathroom by wife and teen by 7.05 at the latest, on bus by 7.30am for an 8am start in the office.

ShaveThis said:

if I have time I turn it into 30 minutes. Quality time I too often don't get anywhere else in my day.

Welcome to B & B.

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Backyard Brewer said:

:-( I wish I had an extra a 30 minutes in the morning. Gym at 6am, home a bit before 7am, kicked out of bathroom by wife and teen by 7.05 at the latest, on bus by 7.30am for an 8am start in the office.

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Then try a cold water shave with a shave stick. When I travel that's what I do and I am finished within 20 minutes.

What is this 'cold water' shave you speak of? That sounds rough! I thought it was all about the hot water and soaking the hair?

Here is a thread about cold water shaving:

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showth...-to-tell-about-it!?highlight=cold+water+shave