Is it flawed logic to concentrate on weight loss first, then strength training?

'Cause that's pretty much what I'm doing. I've joined a gym with a decent amount of equipment, but for the past two months I've focused almost exclusively on running with only some pullups and pushups thrown in.

I understand that increased muscle mass means increased metabolism, and increased metabolism means easier/quicker weight loss. I guess what gets me is devising a routine. I stare at a room full of strength training equipment and I pretty much just don't know where to begin.

So did any of you guys go that route? Did you reach the weight loss goal you wanted and then begin building muscle? Can I even be successful this way if I stick with it? I've dropped 15 pounds already, and I need to drop about 15-20 more. Thanks in advance.

You seem to know the advantages of strength training, but are avoiding it nonetheless. At the same time, you are losing weight and seeing positive results. I would not be concerned at all, it is already working for you. The biggest pitfall is becoming bored in your workout, the way you are going, if ever you get bored with what you are doing you have a whole other half of the gym to discover - so there is no need to rush into it. You can absolutely build muscle after you have lost the excess weight, (at the risk of being corrected by a B&B resident kinesiologist) I doubt that there is any advantage to having extra fat if you are looking to build muscle - now if you are looking to build bulk that would be a different story.

In the mean time, it can only help to familiarize yourself with the weights and some relevant exercises - so that you at least know that you have the option to go to them if you so choose.

I think you should do both at the same time, but yes, concentrate more on your cardio. If you do weights as well your muscles will want feeding, so your body will direct the food (well, at least protein) there first. You might not notice such dramatic weight loss when you get on the scales, as muscle weighs more than fat, but you fat percentage will be going down and you body shape will be improving.

Does your gym have personal trainers? It might be worth paying for one session so they can assess you and work out a program. That will take the guesswork out of it all.

You're going to get a million different answers to this question.

Follow your instincts, if you feel you should focus on cardio, do that. Right now, you're exercising and that's great.

If you are doing legitimate pullups and pushups then you already have some upper body strength. Since you seem to be afraid of all the gym equipment, its important to understand you don't need it for an effective strength program & in some respects the nautilus line of products can result in strength imbalances & injuries. A good body weight program is very effective: pullups, pushups, modified pushups will work a good portion of the upper body; crunches, planks and bicycles will improve core strength; lunges and squats will work the legs (yes even if you're running). In the long run you'll lose body fat quicker and be less prone to injury -- note that I said you'll lose body fat which is different than weight.

Fitness is like a triangle, where all three corners are equally important - cardiovascular training, resistance training and nutrition. Focusing all your efforts on only one side of that triangle is a short-term strategy only, you'll see results but you'll be unbalanced and might end up getting hurt.

You go to a gym, right? Check the class schedule, they all have some "Body Pump" or "Stretch and Strengthen" type class that give you a total body workout with light to moderate weights - perfect for starting out with. Set yourself up in the back row and appreciate the miracle that is yoga pants!

The first step is to define what your goals are in a clear and precise manner. Build a plan to achieve the goals.

If you have a lot of weight to lose it might be easier to do the lifts if you lose it first. It's hard to say. I would suggest checking out a copy of Starting Strength by Mark Rippetoe. In the absence of a coach it is a great resource on how to do the big barbell lifts.

TimmyBoston said:

You're going to get a million different answers to this question.

Follow your instincts, if you feel you should focus on cardio, do that. Right now, you're exercising and that's great.

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Doing something is the biggest improvement you can make.

That said, adding some muscle mass will really help with the weight loss (basically for the reason you mentioned.)

You don't have to train to look like Aaahhnold, just get some muscle going. A few large-muscle-group exercises ... get the legs involved for sure ... on the weight training side of things is the key.

It helps muscle growth to have that extra energy packed around the waste. When a skinny guys muscles are screaming for food but he doesn't eat, the fat guys fat cells are helping out as much as they can. It's also more beneficial to do body weight exercises when your overweight.

But like everyone has pretty much said, if you're doing something and it feels good, you're probably doing it right.

"Ya gotta lose whats in front to get whats behind it"..lose weight first..improvements will follow

Thanks guys. I appreciate all your thoughts.

My weigh-in this morning was 178.6, and I weighed 195.6 when I started all of this about two months ago. I have been pretty consistent with the pushups and pullups (to the extent that I can see muscle definition that wasn't there before), so I don't know what the breakdown is on actual FAT loss. I'd imagine the muscle growth is influencing the number on the scale somewhat. Anyway, I'm in for the long haul. I feel 15 years younger and I wouldn't go back to a sedentary lifestyle for anything in the world.

I prefer to focus on performance instead of body weight. Especially if you're under 200lbs. If you focus on getting stronger, faster, better conditioned, body comp will follow. (as long as you're eating clean... you can't outrun the fork. heh)

My advice is to do both. I see nothing wrong in focusing on weight loss first, but I'd strongly suggest including weight training as part of your program as well, for all the reasons you've already mentioned, and also because it will give you a more stable base for whatever other sports activities you might be involved with. I would suggest keeping the weights low, though, and focusing on form. In addition to pushups and pullups, include squats and DL in your routine. And really focus on nutrition and rest, because incorporating intense squats, DL and running in the same routine can lead to overtraining very quickly.

In terms of devising a routine, you probably have many options, but I'll share what has worked for me. During the last 4 months I've lost almost 20 pounds and 3 inches off my waist on the following 4-days-a-week routine: 15min stretching + 30min on the treadmill, followed by - Mon/Thu chest/shoulders and Tue/Fri DL/pullups. I've taken a break for the last 3 weeks, and am restarting the same routine, but will now add squats to chest days. I've found that my grip is weak for DL, so I've added a set of farmer's walk on Mon/Thu. I also do some ab work most days.

I'm also finding that my flexibility is limited, so working on those aspects during my 15min of stretching. For example, my hamstrings and calves are always tight, and take the most amount of time to loosen up.

Well done on your improved fitness. I support the do what you enjoy approach. Then you will keep doing it and make it and a lifelong habit.

It's easier if you list your body stats such as weight, ht, age ect....you can lose weight by one way and that's a calories deficit. Eat less calories and you will lose weight even without working out. 3500 calories equals 1 pound of fat. So if you list your body stats you can find out exactly how many calories you need to reduce your daily avg intake by. Here's a example...The Katch-McArdle formula applies equally to men and women As FollowsH

BMR = 370 + (21.6 X lean mass in kg)

BMR Example
You are female
You weigh 140 pounds (63.6 kilos)
Your body fat percentage is 25 percent (35 pounds fat, 105 lean)
Your lean mass is 105 pounds (47.7 kilos)
Your BMR = 370 + (21.6 X 47.7) = 1400 calories

To determine your total daily calorie needs, now multiply your BMR by the appropriate activity factor, as follows:

If you are Sedentary - little or no exercise
Calorie-Calculation = BMR X 1.2
If you are Lightly Active (light exercise/sports 1-3 days/week)
Calorie-Calculation = BMR X 1.375
If you are Moderately Active (moderate exercise/sports 3-5 days/week)
Calorie-Calculation = BMR X 1.55
If you are Very Active = BMR X 1.725 (hard exercise/sports 6-7 days/week)
Calorie-Calculation = BMR X 1.725
If you are Extra Active (very hard daily exercise/sports & physical job or 2X day training)
Calorie-Calculation = BMR X 1.9

BMR Example
Your BMR is 1400
Your activity level is moderately active
Your activity factor is 1.55
Your total = 1.55 X 1400 = 2170 calories
Your total daily calorie requirement is therefore 2170 calories.
This is the total number of calories you need in order to MAINTAIN your current weight. Here's one of my favorite sites for working out/nutrition, I'm a member since 06 and have 3,000 or posts there. http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/find-a-plan-fat-loss-2039-male.html

First, be active and learn to ENJOY being active.
Next, if you can learn to love full body resistance routines it will to more to change your body composition that all the cardio in the world. In your full body routines learn to squat and squat PROPERLY. None of those pansy assed stop-before-you-even-touch-parallel butt wiggles, learn to squat deep. It will take core strength and leg flexibility work but it is worth it and it will NOT damage your knees! In fact if you take the time to learn to do it right (don't rush!) it will make your knees stronger than you would have thought possible. Stopping before parallel will WEAKEN your knees and put extreme stress on the joint cartilage. Work all the way down and you won't need super heavy weights to make substantial improvements in your leg strength and body composition.

Most of the respectable trainers I know say pick a goal and stick with it.

If you want to lose weight, work on that.

If you want to train pure strength, work on that.

If you want to bulk, do that.

IF you want to lose weight you have to keep stress to a minimum--stress produces cortisol which equals weight accumulation around the midsection and other places. You probably will not lose weight in your midsection if you are doing heavy strength training--but you can do some abbreviated strength work a few times a week. the remainder of your exercise should be walking. Not running (cortisol producing) Not Crossfit (cortisol producing) and not bodybuilding (because of the fat/weight gain). Just plain walking.

Focusing on strength wok will get you strong, but probably not skinny. Guys that do pure strength and power work (Oly and powerlifters) do not worry about weight loss.

Failure to account for cortisol production is probably one of the bigger reasons people cannot lose weight. Poor diet is the other.

I'd highly recommend you spend some time on the Catalyst Athletics forum, there are more than a few threads there devoted to this very topic. Many of the posters are trainers and will tell you the same thing. I dropped 40 pounds following these guidelines over the course of 3 months.

Oh, and the additional calories burned by additional muscle mass are negligible.

Strength train with weight loss. Increased muscle mass will increase metabolism and increase calories burned - speeding up weight loss.

Find a weight program that makes sense to you and just try it. I have been using the Westside for Skinny Bastards (skinny as in little muscle mass - not just for skinny guys.) Run a search on the elitefts.com and you should find an article laying out the whole routine.

It's a great program an it works.

or, find another one that you connect with and just do it.

Leonard1 said:

Strength train with weight loss. Increased muscle mass will increase metabolism and increase calories burned - speeding up weight loss.

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The additional calories burned by one pound of muscle are negligible, unfortunately. See this link:

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/may/16/health/la-he-fitness-muscle-myth-2011051

That's just one link, there are others.

What most people really want to do when dropping fat is to turn that pound of fat into a pound of muscle, using the fat burned to create new muscle. Lyle McDonald has an interesting article on his site that says while that might be possible for a beginner to do that, there are inefficiencies plus training effects that make it very difficult. Here is the post, it is fairly long:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/adding-muscle-while-losing-fat-qa.html

Lyle has so many articles on fat loss you can easily spend all day reading. Here is a link:

http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss

He has lots of great articles and if you can get past his writing style there is a ton of good info.

Another great link is the Fat loss sub-forum on Catalyst Athletics site. Pretty much everyone on the site knows their stuff, reminds me a lot of the old (now defunct) Old School Strength Training site.

http://www.cathletics.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=7

Another reason to focus exclusively on fat loss is that it improves your body composition much quicker than does putting on muscle. Besides, dropping fat, while not necessarily easy, is magnitudes easier than packing on muscle. Packing on lean muscle (without the attendant fat gain) is even harder.

Take care.