Some Initial Impressions on the Coticule

[dmcconnell]

I've been honing for a little over a year. I started with Nortons and a C12K, then moved to a Shapton Glass set to 16K with CrOX to finish. I recently decided to move to a coticule after sampling a coticule edge. I retained my DMT600 and SG1000 for bevel setting. I've been shaving off the coticule for just about two weeks now and wanted to share some of my early impressions. My limited coticule experience is from a single stone (150x50 La Dressante au bleu or La Veinette) and a sample size of about 10 shaves on about 5 different razors (all vintage French & German). I have another stone to play with when the time is right (La Grosse Blanche).

• First thing - smooth. Absolutely smooth. With the Shaptons you got sharp for free and had to work for smooth. Exactly the opposite with the coticule - smooth is free, the work goes into sharp.
• No more weepers - I haven't seen blood since I started shaving with coticule edges. I have very sensitive skin so anything that reduces irritation is welcome in my routine.
  
• It isn't as difficult as I thought it would be. As a synthetic hone user, I thought I would have difficulty moving to a natural hone. I got a DFS off my first attempt with no irritation (ie: smooth=free) and a BBS off my second attempt. I think this early success may be in part due to 1) Wealth of quality info on how to use these stones from coticule.be and B&B community 2) I am experienced and comfortable with various honing strokes
  
• Working with variability on coticules (ie: managing slurry, controlling dilutions, interpreting feedback, etc) is not entirely unlike interpreting the queues and feedback used in deciding when to move to the next hone in a synthetic progression. I find the coticules are pretty good at providing feedback queues. As noted above I haven't yet challenged myself with managing the variability between coticules.
  
• I need to improve on the sharpness of the edge. I am having difficulty getting good HHT results right off the Coti even when my other edge probing tests return good results (TPT, arm hair, ATG shave). It should be noted that I have never found the HHT to work that well for me. As long as I'm getting good shaving edges, it isn't a huge deal - just not that efficient to have to shave test to know whether I nailed the edge or not. However, I am proceeding assuming that it is the edge with the problem, not the hair or the laws of physics so I will continue to strive for better HHT results.
  
• Hand-holding the hone works well. I have moved from a benchtop stone holder to a handheld approach with the smaller cotis. It was not a difficult change to make.
  
• Lower overhead. What I mean by this is that it is overall less work to hone on this setup. It is just so easy to get out the single stone (+slurry) and go at it. The amount of time spent not honing (ie: handling several hones during set up, progression, clean up and storage) is cut dramatically.
  

I welcome any feedback or comments.

[Munxcub]

Excellent report Dallas. I found what really steps up my HHT is a good stropping, and then 50 x-strokes on water. I do this a few times (the stropping in between is key for me). If it shaves well but could be keener, I will do 50 laps on water before every shave. After a few shaves its usually pretty happenin!

[Woodash]

[*]First thing - smooth. Absolutely smooth. With the Shaptons you got sharp for free and had to work for smooth. Exactly the opposite with the coticule - smooth is free, the work goes into sharp.

Interesting observation.

Are you using the coti start to finish, or are you using something else to set bevel?

[Sando]

Good report.

[*]First thing - smooth. Absolutely smooth. With the Shaptons you got sharp for free and had to work for smooth. Exactly the opposite with the coticule - smooth is free, the work goes into sharp.

I like how you put that - I find it to be the same for me.

No more weepers - I haven't seen blood since I started shaving with coticule edges. I have very sensitive skin so anything that reduces irritation is welcome in my routine.

I think weepers for me is due to using crox. I just don't get them with a coticule edge alone.

Hand-holding the hone works well.

I like the hone in hand for finishing. Setting a bevel requires two hands for me so I keep it on a piece of glass on the sink.

...Ray

[dmcconnell]

Interesting observation.

Are you using the coti start to finish, or are you using something else to set bevel?

All, except one of the razors I've done thus far have had their bevels set elsewhere. I used the coticule from bevel refresh to final finish.

Also, re-reading what I wrote, I may be oversimplifying. Sharp on Shaptons is not 'Free' as it took a lot of work to get there, but for me sharp came before smooth.

[dmcconnell]

Excellent report Dallas. I found what really steps up my HHT is a good stropping, and then 50 x-strokes on water. I do this a few times (the stropping in between is key for me). If it shaves well but could be keener, I will do 50 laps on water before every shave. After a few shaves its usually pretty happenin!

Great advice. When the edge hasn't been right immediately after a shave I have been restarting the dilucot. Instead, I'll attempt the refining steps you mention and try again.

[Munxcub]

Great advice. When the edge hasn't been right immediately after a shave I have been restarting the dilucot. Instead, I'll attempt the refining steps you mention and try again.

Yeah there's no need to go back to a full slurry/dilucot if the edge is almost there. It just needs a little more refining. It'd be like going back to your <4k stone instead of spending a bit more time on the finisher.

[dmcconnell]

Good point, I never thought of it that way.

On a related note - I finally found the words to describe another observation I have on these:

Coticules are 'lower overhead'. What I mean by this is that it is overall less work to hone on this setup. It is so easy to get out the single stone (+slurry) and go at it. The amount of time spent not honing (ie: handling several hones during set up, progression, clean up and storage) is cut dramatically.

[Woodash]

All, except one of the razors I've done thus far have had their bevels set elsewhere. I used the coticule from bevel refresh to final finish.

Also, re-reading what I wrote, I may be oversimplifying. Sharp on Shaptons is not 'Free' as it took a lot of work to get there, but for me sharp came before smooth.

I was actually thinking that what you said made sense.

[SliceOfLife]

Lower overhead is my favorite part of coti's.

I'm not sure what everyone's definition of weepers is, but I get "seepers", which are patches of blood forming on my face not from any cuts, but from simply shaving off skin (razor sharp enough it slices every little bump and texture on your skin off without pause, you don't notice until you see spots of blood that look like something out of a House episode). For my face, Coti's don't get sharp enough to do this. Thuri's really don't either. China nats, barber synths, etc, don't either. Pastes, Jnats, likely some other ultra high grit natural stones, and possibly shapton 30k (I've only tried it on a wedge, and it didn't on that blade) will.

Palming the stone is great if the razor doesn't need any special attention like a sweep or rocking stroke... for more difficult razors I still prefer the bench. The main downside I find with palming is I have to set something down to dilute.

[Sando]

I'm not sure what everyone's definition of weepers is, but I get "seepers", which are patches of blood forming on my face not from any cuts, but from simply shaving off skin (razor sharp enough it slices every little bump and texture on your skin off without pause, you don't notice until you see spots of blood that look like something out of a House episode). For my face, Coti's don't get sharp enough to do this.

"Seepers" is what I'm referring to, also. Coticule is the only stone I've used and I won't be trying the others since I get the results I want. HAD won't hit me...

...Ray

[dakotaev]

Good point, I never thought of it that way.

On a related note - I finally found the words to describe another observation I have on these:

Coticules are 'lower overhead'. What I mean by this is that it is overall less work to hone on this setup. It is so easy to get out the single stone (+slurry) and go at it. The amount of time spent not honing (ie: handling several hones during set up, progression, clean up and storage) is cut dramatically.

YES! This is also what I love, and the fact I don't have to sit and wait while my synths soak in the sink for 15 minutes.