Pu'erh Questions

[SCWilson]

Please forgive my ignorance, but I'm a little confused. I've been looking at different pu'erhs and have seen the same name made by differen factories. My question is, are these the same recipe just made by different factories, and therefore somewhat different but very simmilar, or is it just a coincidence? Also is a 7542 from one company similar to a 7542 from another?

Thanks.

Sam

[Scotto]

In principle the blends, like the 7542 you mention, are the same between different manufacturers. However, how the leaf is treated and stored can make a huge difference. For instance, the Menghai 8582 and the Xi Zi Hao 8582 don't taste much alike to me at all, due to XZH's kill-green process and oxidation levels being different.

[SCWilson]

Thanks, that cleared things up for me. This is all pretty new to me. It seems that there are some similarities between pu'erh and pipe tobacco in that differen manufacturers could use the same blend of tobaccos and come up with many differnt products based on how it was all processed.

[TacoBell]

So what do the numbers signify? And the difference between 'uncooked' and 'cooked' Pu-erh?

[Proinsias]

http://www.wikicha.com/index.php/Puerh#Recipes

This will save me some typing and is probably clearer than my attempt would be.

[Proinsias]

and:

http://www.wikicha.com/index.php/Puerh#Production

[ouch]

So what do the numbers signify? And the difference between 'uncooked' and 'cooked' Pu-erh?

The first two numbers are the year the recipe was invented. The third number is the grade of leaf, with a lower number representing a higher grade. The last number is the factory-
1- Kunming
2- Manghai
3- Xiauguan
4- Feng Qing and Lancang seem to be in a steel cage match for that number
5- no specified
6- Six Famous Tea Mountain
7- not specified
8- Haiwan or Long Sheng

So a 7542, for example, would be a recipe created in 1975, using 4th grade leaf, from the Menghai Tea Factory.

[Scotto]

Ah, but don't forget that the grade of leaf used often has little to nothing to do with the overall quality and taste of the tea, IMO. Go figure.

[Scotto]

So what do the numbers signify? And the difference between 'uncooked' and 'cooked' Pu-erh?

Think of your compost pile and you'll have a good idea of what they do to shu "cooked" pu'er. Gross.

[ouch]

Ah, but don't forget that the grade of leaf used often has little to nothing to do with the overall quality and taste of the tea, IMO. Go figure.

Ture- I think I prefer the 8582 blend to the 7542 blend, for example, despite the "lower" grade leaf.

[Suzuki]

Think of your compost pile and you'll have a good idea of what they do to shu "cooked" pu'er. Gross.

Very apt description.

The first pu'erh I ever tried was a mini-toucha of some low grade shu - I thought I had brewed the sweepings of a horse barn/mushroom farm.

While better shus have their charms, I'm not overly fond of them - in some ways, they're like pinot noir, which can have barnyard/musty notes - when in the right proportion, they can be quite nice, but if too strong, blech :tongue_sm

[Proinsias]

I was under the impression that the grade referred to the size of the leaf and where it was picked from the stem as opposed to a mark of quality, also how broken up it is. Many pu-erh's can also be a mix of grades, occasionally the most sought after on the outside of the cake and the more unpleasant broken stuff in the middle.

Akin to the FTGF OP system often used in Indian tea which seems to have an increasing irrelevance to the quality of the cuppa.

[Proinsias]

Suzuki - I tend to find the opposite. Shu, whist nowhere near as complex as sheng, tends to be a far more forgiving tea for the brewer and is unlikely to require the resistance of a whisky drinker if a little overbrewed.

[Suzuki]

Suzuki - I tend to find the opposite. Shu, whist nowhere near as complex as sheng, tends to be a far more forgiving tea for the brewer and is unlikely to require the resistance of a whisky drinker if a little overbrewed.

I do agree with you there - shus tend to have none of the bitterness of shengs and are much more forgiving of brewing methods, time and leaf to water ratios (at least in my very limited experience).

I just don't like the flavours of most shus and in many shops, when you ask for a pu'erh, all they'll likely have are one or two mediocre to lousy shus - this initial, often negative, experience is why lots of folks think they don't like pu'erh as a genre.

[TacoBell]

Awesome responses. Thanks guys. As always B&B to the rescue. Fantastic links.

[TacoBell]

I do agree with you there - shus tend to have none of the bitterness of shengs and are much more forgiving of brewing methods, time and leaf to water ratios (at least in my very limited experience).

I just don't like the flavours of most shus and in many shops, when you ask for a pu'erh, all they'll likely have are one or two mediocre to lousy shus - this initial, often negative, experience is why lots of folks think they don't like pu'erh as a genre.

This may have been my experience. I will let you know once I have tried my shengs.

[Suzuki]

This may have been my experience. I will let you know once I have tried my shengs.

Make sure you use enough leaves and very short brew times for the first few infusions (when using a tea for the first couple of timesI generally do a short rinse of 5 to 10 seconds (which is discarded) and then brew for 5, 10, 15, 20, 30 seconds - and then adjust accordingly depending on the tea).

If you use too many leaves and/or brew too long, you'll get a very bitter cup.

[netsurfr]

Thanks Ouch!
That was information that I had read before but had forgotten. Very useful!!!


The first two numbers are the year the recipe was invented. The third number is the grade of leaf, with a lower number representing a higher grade. The last number is the factory-
1- Kunming
2- Manghai
3- Xiauguan
4- Feng Qing and Lancang seem to be in a steel cage match for that number
5- no specified
6- Six Famous Tea Mountain
7- not specified
8- Haiwan or Long Sheng

So a 7542, for example, would be a recipe created in 1975, using 4th grade leaf, from the Menghai Tea Factory.

[expatCanuck]

... and is unlikely to require the resistance of a whisky drinker ...Resistance? Why would I resist? :wink:

- Richard (who will be heading out to his habitual Monday night bar / open mike this evening and will make a point of not resisting)

P.S. - To echo some of the others, many thanks to all for sharing the collective Pu-erh wisdom. Much to learn.