Two Differnet Kinds Of Feather Blades???

[JoePerri]

Hi All,

I have noticed that I have two different kinds of Feather blades. They came from two different sources and I am wondering what the difference is. Is one just a newer version with updated graphics? Two different types? Is one a knock-off? One feels a bit thicker than the other. Unfortunately I did not use them back to back and only have one kind left so I can't speak to a difference between them. One did seem a little harsher than I remembered but sense memory is a tricky thing. Does anyone know anything about this? Please see the pic below.

Thanks Joe


http://lh6.google.com/JoePerrigoue/RxpMktwZNlI/AAAAAAAAAEI/7FxD_yAxoIA/s800/PICT1739.JPG

[Taz]

i can not tell you why but there is 2 I have had 2 types

[JoePerri]

Are those two types the same?

Thanks,
Joe

[copperhead]

Is one of the blades from CottonBlossoms ? I think one other member felt there was a difference in the shaves. One more aggressive than the other.

[JoePerri]

After digging around some more it seems that the difference is indeed the platinum coating. There may be some other manufacturing differences as well. The "Hi-stainless" appears to be an older blade while the "NeW Hi-Stainless" is the newer platinum coated variety. It is unclear what effect the platinum coating will have on the feel of the blade. It seems that it was developed in the late sixties by Gillette to "reduce corrosion and damage" to the blade edge. That would seem to be in an effort to prolong blade life. This could mean that one will get the same feel but more shaves from a platinum coated blade. It could also mean that one might get a smoother feel from a coated blade. I found a study here (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TW0-410M9D9-26&_user=10&_coverDate=12%2F01%2F1995&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=d72f4e805b17e7244a5feb9051fb779b) that seems to have some good info but I can't pay $30 for the full paper.

Anybody else have any info?

Thanks,
Joe

[Paul_the_Shaver]

It is unclear what effect the platinum coating will have on the feel of the blade. It seems that it was developed in the late sixties by Gillette to "reduce corrosion and damage" to the blade edge. That would seem to be in an effort to prolong blade life. This could mean that one will get the same feel but more shaves from a platinum coated blade. It could also mean that one might get a smoother feel from a coated blade. I found a study here (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TW0-410M9D9-26&_user=10&_coverDate=12%2F01%2F1995&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=d72f4e805b17e7244a5feb9051fb779b) that seems to have some good info but I can't pay $30 for the full paper.

Anybody else have any info?
You can get a lot of information free from U.S. patents. There's some history of blade coating in these two but there are many, many more.

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/6684513-description.html

http://www.patentstorm.us/patents/5433801-description.html

Basically coating was intended to hold down rust thus getting more shaves from a blade. When I first started shaving in 1954, I used Gillette blue blades, then silicone coated ones, then stainless steel then platinum chromium coated. When Gillette quit selling blades made in America, I switched to Schick triple coated which is what I still use today. I got 2-3 shaves with blue blades and 5-7 with coated ones.

[skippiks27]

I just picked up a bunch of the non-platinum coated blades - old stock that Pauldog is selling off in his 250 packs. Had my first shave with one this morning. Seemed to have had the same results as the platinum coated variety but it felt to me to be less smooth. After a few more shaves I'll check back and see if this was a one-off experience. Anyone else weigh in on this?

[JokerJon]

After digging around some more it seems that the difference is indeed the platinum coating. There may be some other manufacturing differences as well. The "Hi-stainless" appears to be an older blade while the "NeW Hi-Stainless" is the newer platinum coated variety. It is unclear what effect the platinum coating will have on the feel of the blade. It seems that it was developed in the late sixties by Gillette to "reduce corrosion and damage" to the blade edge. That would seem to be in an effort to prolong blade life. This could mean that one will get the same feel but more shaves from a platinum coated blade. It could also mean that one might get a smoother feel from a coated blade. I found a study here (http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6TW0-410M9D9-26&_user=10&_coverDate=12%2F01%2F1995&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=d72f4e805b17e7244a5feb9051fb779b) that seems to have some good info but I can't pay $30 for the full paper.

Anybody else have any info?

Thanks,
Joe

Here is the full paper, without figures.


Abstract
Razor blade technology involves not only the forming of the cutting edge (final facet) but the protection of that edge from damage and
corrosion. This requirement has led to the deposition of various types of metallic, ceramic and organic coatings to the final facet to prolong
the useful life of the blade. In this study, Auger electron spectroscopy and secondary electron microscopy are employed to characterize the
final facet of razor blades from various manufacturers. Each analysis emphasized the final facet morphology and coating composition. The
blades are analyzed before and after ‘pithing’ to remove the fluorocarbon lubricant and other oils found on most blades. The typical coating
was found to be chromium, but platinum alloys and iron oxides are also observed. The chromium coatings are fully oxidized in some cases,
and in others exhibit only a surface oxide. Sputter depth profiling is implemented to determine relative coating thickness and interfacial
chemistry.

Keywords: Auger electron spectroscopy; Coatings; Depth profiling: Scanning electron microscopy

1. Introduction
The first safety razors were conceived by King Camp Gillette
in 1901. With the help of an MIT-educated engineer
named William Nickerson, he perfected and patented the
safety razor in 1903 [ 11. This ‘kit’ as it was called, came
with the razor holder and twenty pre-sharpened double-edged
blades made of high carbon steel. These blades could be
sharpened easily enough but quickly lost the edge due to
corrosion [ 21. A subsequent material used was high carbon
stainless steel ( 13% Cr, 1% carbon, nominal composition)
which proved to have a longer shaving life. Eventually, a
variation of this alloy with lower carbon became the industry
standard for razor blade material.
In recent years, metallurgical coatings have been found
useful for reducing the effects of wear and corrosion on the
razor blade final facet. This is particularly important because
the final facet is required to maintain a specific geometry and
surface chemistry in order to perform as designed. To provide
reasonable shaving comfort, the blade edge should have a
radius of curvature small enough to be sharp but large enough
to allow the blade to slide over the surface of the skin and
only cut the hair it encounters. Further, this region of the
blade should be as impervious as possible to oxidation (rusting),
corrosion (chemical effects of shaving creams, soaps,
etc.) and damage.

With all of the above requirements, it is obvious that even
a bare steel edge, the design prevalent until the mid-1950s,
would have a fairly short lifetime in a shaving environment.
The first approach to surface passivation was simply to anneal
the blade, which oxidized the surface, forming a thin ( < 100
A) ceramic coating. Other passivation schemes included
annealing in various atmospheres, such as hydrocarbon gases
to carbonize the surface, and applying a thin film of material
less susceptible to corrosion. All of this has evolved into the
comparatively elegant coatings now used on razor blade
edges.

Shaving comfort was still a problem. As clean-shaven faces
became more fashionable and consumer demand increased,
the blade industry responded by attempting to apply lubricants
to the blade edge. The earliest petroleum-based lubricants
were too easily removed and remained on the blade for
only a few strokes. Silicones were eventually tried and exhibited
better adhesion properties, particularly when a bake was
applied to the coated blade. Blade life was lengthened and
shaving comfort improved.

With the advent of polymeric coatings, intrinsic lubrication
in blade coating technology took a new turn. Polytetrafluoroethylene
(PTFE) was a natural choice, given the insolubility
and lubricity of the material. However, adhesion properties
(to steel) were poor, and the only scheme that worked was
the application of a very thick layer, which peeled away with
the first shave, leaving a thin, lubricating film. It was soon
discovered that an intermediate coating of chromium provided
a better base for adhesion and many manufacturers
incorporated chromium coatings on their blades. Subsequent
research and empirical study revealed the corrosion-resistant
nature of chromium and chromium alloys [ 31. More recent
coating schemes include nitriding, adding a second phase
material as intrinsic lubrication, and multilayers. Auger analysis
of nitrided coatings has been shown to be an effective
method of characterizing these surfaces [4]. An attempt was
made to include at least one of each of the more typical
coatings for a representative study.

2. Experimental
All razor blades were purchased at retail shops to ensure
the ‘consumer-ready’ condition of the blade. Each blade was
removed from the respective holder with clean tools, using
care to minimize damage to the cutting edge. Three blades
from each manufacturer were labeled with indelible ink, and
a ‘front’ and ‘back’ were designated. Two of each blade was
then pithed six times, using fresh plant pith and a different
area on the pith, to reduce cross-contamination of the organic
material. Each blade was mounted on a stainless steel stage
with a machined trough, with the edge positioned over the
trough to minimize back-sputtering from the stage. One area
on the ‘front’ of each blade was analyzed to obtain the average
composition and film thickness. If a significant difference
was observed, a third measurement was made. The backside
of two different blades was measured for coating uniformity
and this data is also discussed. Manufacturer identity is not
disclosed and blades are designated as the letters A-I.
Analysis was performed on a Perkin-Elmer Model 660
Scanning Auger Microprobe using a LaB, electron source.
Primary beam energy was 10 keV at 1 .O p,A sample current,
resulting in a beam diameter of approximately 1 pm. Ionsputtered
depth profiling was accomplished using 3 keV Ar+
ions produced by electron impact, extracted, and rastered over
a 2 mm2 area with a total current of 2.8 PA, which resulted
in a sputter rate of 180 A min ’ relative to SiOz. (Ion gun
maintenance performed during the study increased the sputter
rate to 250 A min - ’ . Tables are corrected for the chromium
sputter rate obtained from a standard measured with X-ray
fluorescence.) System pressure was maintained at
< 1 X 10d9 Torr using a 220 1 s- ’ ion pump. All data acquisition
and massage was performed through an Apollo workstation
and Unix-based software.
Each analytical area was surveyed prior to sputtering to
ascertain surface composition before removing material.
Fig. 1 indicates the region of the analysis relative to the blade
edge. The major species observed on the surface of each blade
was then included in the sputter profile routine as well as iron,
used as a substrate marker. Profiles were terminated when the
bulk composition of the base material reached steady-state
condition. In the event that the pithing did not remove enough
lubricant to determine the coating composition, the profile
was suspended when the carbon reached 50% of the original
value and a survey performed to determine the true coating
composition. In one case a solvent was used to remove an
extraordinarily thick lubricant.

3. Results and discussion
The blade coatings analyzed in this study can be divided
into three categories; no coating, single coating, including
alloys, and multi-layered (including nitrided) . The lubricant
is not considered a ‘coating’, although analyses of several
blades not pithed showed the lubricant to be fluorocarbonbased.
Fig. 2 is representative of the spectra from these lubricants.
Chromium is universally the coating material. However,
several modifications of the chromium layer were observed,
either intentional or accidental. Blades are categorized below,
using the criteria mentioned in the above paragraph.

3.1. Simple coating (blades A, B, C, D)
These blades appeared to be chromium-coated with a surface
and interfacial oxide of varying thickness. Blade C
exhibited the least amount of surface and interfacial oxidation,
probably the result of a very clean substrate and coater
vacuum system. Conversely, in one of the samples for blade
D, oxygen and carbon appeared to be incorporated in the
entire coating. Further, the position of the relative maximum
peak intensities for chromium, oxygen and iron signals at the
coating-substrate interface suggested a mixed oxide as well.
It should also be mentioned that the reverse side of another
sample of blade D proved to have very little surface and
interfacial oxygen and a distinctly different coating thickness.
Two of the samples for blade A exhibited a well-defined
oxide layer at the surface and interface, indicative of minimal
preparation of the substrate. However, the third sample
showed carbon and oxygen throughout the coating as seen in
blade D.

3.2. Multi-layered or alloyed (blades E, F, G)
Chromium is the predominant material, but blade E has a
surface which appears to have been nitrided, on a pure chromium
layer. This could be accomplished as a co-deposition
during the blade processing, or as a separate step using a
nitrogen or NH, glow discharge. The thickness of the nitrogen-
containing layer was approximately 100 A, using the
half-maximum of the nitrogen signal as an interface and the
sputter rate correction for nitrides.
Blades F and G both claimed to have platinum as an additive,
(corrosion resistance?) but it was only detected on blade
F, limiting the amount in the coating on blade G to be less
than 0.5 at.%, which is the effective detection limit for platinum
in Auger spectroscopy using these conditions.

3.3. No coating (blades H, I)
These blades had such a thin chromium-containing coating
that it was assumed to be only enrichment/oxidation due to
annealing rather than an applied layer. The behavior of the
elements followed in the profile attest to this, where the oxygen
and iron immediately increase and the chromium
decreases, with no apparent coating morphology or true ‘layering’
observed. Blade H was wire-wrapped, with the coil
spacing approximately 50 pm, apparently to ‘align’ the hairs
before shaving.

Fig. 3(a) and 3(b) and Fig. 4(a) and 4(b) illustrate the
profiles that are representative of each coating morphology,
except for the platinum-containing coatings, in which case
the platinum is in the noise and only evident in a montage
display of the energy ‘windows’ used to generate the profile.
The actual thickness of the coatings is based on the sputter
rate for pure chromium, and will therefore exhibit error with
the magnitude of the error inversely proportional to the
amount of pure chromium in the film. Also, surface and
interfacial chemistry was not absolutely determined by suspending
the profile routine and acquiring a survey. It was
assumed that the elements followed in the survey would be
the constituents of the interfaces and only the stoichiometry
would change. Further, detection of minor impurities and
contaminants was not the purpose of this study.
Table 1 lists the blades analyzed, coating type (if present),
and coating thickness, based on the intersection of the major
coating cation and iron. There are also comments describing
any aspects of the coating worth mentioning.

Summary
Despite the seemingly wide variety of coating morphology,
chromium is the common denominator. Differences in coating
thickness, degree of oxidation, interfacial chemistry and
additives all serve to change the blade performance. However,
without knowledge of the efficacy of each coating/
blade in a shaving environment, it is impossible to establish
a cause-effect relationship. For obvious reasons, we can
assume that the uncoated blade life (H and I) will be shorter
than that of the coated blade. Variations in coating thickness
will also certainly affect blade life, as would interfacial chemistry
(coating spalling) and surface composition (corrosion
resistance). Further study in a collaborative effort using test
results would be necessary for this information.
What this study does show is that blade coating technology
has gotten quite sophisticated, particularly with the nitrided
blades. Additionally, the lack of an interfacial oxide in some
of the blades (particularly Blade C), implies in-situ pretreatment,
such as plasma etching, before coating. Addition
of platinum as a corrosion inhibitor also suggests innovative
metallurgy. There are still problems, considering the nonuniformity
of coating thickness and composition between
blades and even sides of the same lot.
This study was undertaken to illustrate the application of
surface analysis, specifically Auger electron spectroscopy,
for characterizing these types of coatings. It has been shown
that the technique is well-suited for these types of analyses.
Future coating materials will include more sophisticated
alloys, ceramics, and certainly diamond and diamond-like
coatings, all requiring similar characterization. Auger spectroscopy
could be an important analytical tool in the development
of these coatings.

Acknowledgements
The author is extremely grateful to Brian Balistee for his
many useful discussions and advice.
References
[ 11 N. Aaseng, BetterMousefraps, Lemer Publications, Minneapolis, 1990,
pp. 29-37.
121 J.F. Sackman, Wilkinson Sword Cornpuny, company publication.
[31 K. Natesan and R.N. Johnson, Surface Coatings Technol.. 33 (1987)
341-351.
[4] S. Hofmann, J. Vat. Sci. Technol., A4(6) (1986) 2789-2796.

If anyone wants the pdf with the figures and tables, just pm me. Maybe you know how to post them in format, I don't.

[JoePerri]

Thank you very much for posting that paper! Really very nice of you.

It is an interesting read. It does seem that the platinum is all about prolonging blade life. The really interesting part is where they mention that the coating increases the radius of the blade edge. This would make a coated blade slightly less sharp than an un-coated blade. Since high carbon steel is stronger and can be given a sharper edge, the ultimate blade would seem to be a high carbon blade that you throw away after one use. Of course that would be very expensive and wasteful.

I have contacted Feather and asked what the difference is between the blades. Hopefully they will provide an answer.

I ordered some New Hi-stainless platinum blades to compare to my regular hi-stainless. I intend to do a blind test to see if I can feel a difference. I will have my wife load up two identical razors and will shave alternately with each for 8 days total. I will then repeat the experiment and post my results. Of course I now need an identical twin for my 59 Fatboy or 56 Superspeed. Anyone have one they want to part with?

Joe

[JokerJon]

At the behest of guenron, here are pictures of pages 2-4 ([page 1 has no figures)
1. Introduction
The first safety razors were conceived by King Camp Gillette
in 1901. With the help of an MIT-educated engineer
named William Nickerson, he perfected and patented the
safety razor in 1903 [ 11. This ‘kit’ as it was called, came
with the razor holder and twenty pre-sharpened double-edged
blades made of high carbon steel. These blades could be
sharpened easily enough but quickly lost the edge due to
corrosion [ 21. A subsequent material used was high carbon
stainless steel ( 13&#37; Cr, 1% carbon, nominal composition)
which proved to have a longer shaving life. Eventually, a
variation of this alloy with lower carbon became the industry
standard for razor blade material.
In recent years, metallurgical coatings have been found
useful for reducing the effects of wear and corrosion on the
razor blade final facet. This is particularly important because
the final facet is required to maintain a specific geometry and
surface chemistry in order to perform as designed. To provide
reasonable shaving comfort, the blade edge should have a
radius of curvature small enough to be sharp but large enough
to allow the blade to slide over the surface of the skin and
only cut the hair it encounters. Further, this region of the
blade should be as impervious as possible to oxidation (rusting),
corrosion (chemical effects of shaving creams, soaps,
etc.) and damage.

With all of the above requirements, it is obvious that even
a bare steel edge, the design prevalent until the mid-1950s,
would have a fairly short lifetime in a shaving environment.
The first approach to surface passivation was simply to anneal
the blade, which oxidized the surface, forming a thin ( < 100
A) ceramic coating. Other passivation schemes included
annealing in various atmospheres, such as hydrocarbon gases
to carbonize the surface, and applying a thin film of material
less susceptible to corrosion. All of this has evolved into the
comparatively elegant coatings now used on razor blade
edges.

Shaving comfort was still a problem. As clean-shaven faces
became more fashionable and consumer demand increased,
the blade industry responded by attempting to apply lubricants
to the blade edge. The earliest petroleum-based lubricants
were too easily removed and remained on the blade for
only a few strokes. Silicones were eventually tried and exhibited
better adhesion properties, particularly when a bake was
applied to the coated blade. Blade life was lengthened and
shaving comfort improved.

With the advent of polymeric coatings, intrinsic lubrication
in blade coating technology took a new turn. Polytetrafluoroethylene
(PTFE) was a natural choice, given the insolubility
and lubricity of the material. However, adhesion properties
(to steel) were poor, and the only scheme that worked was
the application of a very thick layer, which peeled away with
http://www.badgerandblade.com/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=9390&original=1
http://www.badgerandblade.com/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=9391&original=1
http://www.badgerandblade.com/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=9392&original=1

[JoePerri]

I posted a WTB here (http://www.badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=28792) for a '59 Fat Boy to use in the experiment. If I can't find one here I'll head over to ebay. Probably wind up paying $60 just for an experiment...:rolleyes: At least I can sell it once I'm done. :smile:

Joe

[BarryR]

I hope the old ones are pretty much the same (shave-wise) since I just got my carton of 250 from Pauldog!

[JoePerri]

Well the Feather blade experiment was supposed to start tomorrow but I have hit a snag. I ordered a 10 pack of the New Hi-Stainless Platinum coated blades from classicshaving.com to compare against my older Hi-Stainless non-platinum blades. Unfortunately, when I took one of the Platinum coated blades out of the pack from classicshaving to take some pictures under the microscope, I found the old style blade! I checked the rest of the pack and sure enough all 10 are the old style blade, NOT the new platinum coated blade. The package clearly states "New Hi-Stainless Platinum Coated Blade" but the printing on the blade is the old style. See the pics above in my first post if that does not make sense. The new platinum blades clearly say "Platinum Coated" right on the blade, these do not. In looking at the pics on the classicshaving.com site you can see the old style blade next to the new platinum coated packaging. The package was sealed in plastic wrap so I doubt the classicshaving guys are trying to pull a fast one but they may have been taken by their supplier. It is also possible that Feather Safety Razor Co. was briefly using the old printing on the new blades. I will email classicshaving.com and see what they can turn up. Unfortunately the experiment must be put on hold until this gets cleared up. :frown:

[BarryR]

That's really weird. Isn't Classicshaving.com the only official Feather distributor in the U.S.?

[letterk]

That's really weird. Isn't Classicshaving.com the only official Feather distributor in the U.S.?

Yup. They're the only importer.

With the blade you got from Classic, where they in a clear plastic box or a white plastic box?

[JoePerri]

They are in a white plastic box.

If they are importing them direct from the manufacturer then they must be the new blades with old printing. Perhaps Feather did not update the blade graphics until very recently. I'll see if I can verify this with Feather.

John, I know the blades that came in the sampler I got from you were the "NeW Hi-Stainless". Any chance I could buy a very small number of just the new feathers for this experiment?

Joe

[Pauldog]

At Feather's own online store, all they had were the Hi-Stainless ones:

http://www.feather-shop.com/cgibin/hotcake04.pl?SeihinName=09&#37;20%83n%83C%81E%83X%83e% 83%93%83%8c%83X%97%bc%90n%2030%96%87%2810%96%87%93 %fc%81%7e3%83p%83b%83N%29%81%401%2e575%89%7e%81i%9 0%c5%94%b21%2e500%89%7e%81j

[JoePerri]

Yep, those are the older ones. It looks like that website has not been updated since 2000 though.

Joe

[collinarose]

Does it make a difference if they come in the clear plastic box vs. the white one?

[Pauldog]

The main page has a copyright year of 2000:
http://www.feather-shop.com/

That doesn't necessarily give us the correct age of all the pages within.

As for clear vs. white plastic:
The Feather 10-pack that I have has a clear plastic outer case and a white plastic inner tray. On the bottom of the case is a "10" and the blades are marked "NeW Hi-Stainless Platinum Coated Blades".

I can't find a 5-pack to check, by my recollection is that it had a white plastic case. I don't remember the blade markings. If I had known about the difference earlier, I would have made sure to keep a 5-pack for reference.

[collinarose]

The Classic Shaving website has this picture of the all-white case and an unwrapped blade. Seems like the all-white cases have the non-platinum blades even though the packaging says Platinum.

-Collin

[JoePerri]

The Classic Shaving website has this picture of the all-white case and an unwrapped blade. Seems like the all-white cases have the non-platinum blades even though the packaging says Platinum.

-Collin

Yes. That is the entire point of my post above.

I have emailed classic but not heard back yet.

Joe

[collinarose]

I did the same yesterday so we'll see what we hear back. Luckily I still have 4 10-packs of the clear plastic outer case variety and the blades in those say platinum on them so I'm not in a hurry just yet. I e-mailed CAR at Enchante to ask him and he was not familiar with the non-platinum Feather blade.

-Collin

[tm3]

to further confuse the issue i bought a 5 pack of feathers from classicshaving several months ago. box is white plastic, like in the photo, label says platinum like photo, blades are marked platinum.

i was about to stockpile while i can but am concerned about the platinum coating making a difference.

[JoePerri]

Classic Shaving just got back to me to say that they are waiting to hear from the manufacturer on the issue.

Joe

[Pauldog]

I just found a few 5-packs lying around. They have a white outer case, and they're marked "NeW Hi-Stainless Platinum Coated Blade".

[collinarose]

Pauldog, what's marked platinum, the blades themselves or the "dummy" blade cardboard label?

-Collin

[Pauldog]

The blades and the card insert are both marked the same on my 5-packs, with the magic words "New" and "Platinum". [Boy, do I wish I still had these to sell!]

It seems likely to me that Classic Shaving's blade packs are newer than mine (very likely), and my cartons of 250 are older than both (pretty likely).

[scoopster]

I've just finished one of these older non-Platinum High Stainless blades from a batch I got from Pauldog. Here are my first impressions:

A caveat - this is only from three shaves with one blade. I need to use a few more blades before I would say my experience is definitive.


Used this blade three times, then discarded. That is what I ususally get from a Platinum Feather (sometimes two, four of five shaves but usualy the number is three, three being the number...).
This did not feel as sharp as any of the Platinum Feathers I've used. The blade did feel sharper than the IP's and Derbys. I regularly use Derby/IP so for me the difference was pretty noticable.
This blade provided excellent shaves with no harshness. Note that I have mixed experiences with the Platinum blades. Sometimes a Platinum blade will provide great shaves, sometimes a blade will be very harsh on my skin for every shave and I'll ususally bail on it after two.

I didn't mind that this blade was not as sharp as Platinum Feathers; the shaves were great. I am going to keep using them and if they consistently provide shaves like the blade I just used I'll be happy camper.

[Pauldog]

Has anyone compared the "Hi-Stainless" blades from Classic Shaving with the "New Hi-Stainless Platinum" blades?

[JoePerri]

Has anyone compared the "Hi-Stainless" blades from Classic Shaving with the "New Hi-Stainless Platinum" blades?

That is exactly what I'm trying to do but I can't get any of the "NeW Hi-Stainless" to compare them to. I have the older blades("Hi-Stainless") from you and the claimed "Platinum Hi-Stainless"(but seemingly identical) from classic but none of the newest blades. I have emailed both classicshaving.com & feather but have not gotten an answer back from either yet.

There seems to be three kinds of blades:

Hi-Stainless (the older ones in the black and gray package)

Platinum Hi-Stainless (platinum coated blades in the new yellow & red package BUT with the old style printing on the blade)

NeW Platinum Hi-Stainless (the newest blade with the yellow & red package AND the new printing on the blade)

It's all very confusing right now.

I am doing a blind test with the older blades and the blades from classic just to see what if I can tell the difference. I am on the second 8 day trial and should have results this weekend or early next week.

Joe


Joe

[JoePerri]

Just a quick update.

I have heard back from classic. There seems to be some confusion. Classic claims that Feather told them that the blades with the old style printing(the blade on the right in the pic up top) have not been made since the late 80's. That makes sense for the blades from Paul but NOT for the blades from classic! If that is true then classic is selling old blades. I don't think that is the case though. I think there has just been a mis-communication between classic and the guys in Japan or classic is just blowing me off with a tall tale and hoping I don't care. I've emailed the pic back to classic and asked them to confirm what they have been told. If I don't get an answer soon my plan is to have a guy I know in Japan investigate. I'll have him buy some blades locally, take pics and then call & email Feather for an explanation. Since he is fluent in Japanese I expect he will get a better answer.

Joe

[letterk]

Joe, I don't think Classic is selling NOS blades. Not recently for sure. They seem to have a decent stock turnover.

[JoePerri]

I agree. That is why I think there must be some mis-communication or something.

Joe

[Pauldog]

Maybe you can also get an explanation for the supposedly older style blades being the only ones listed on Feather's online store.

A mystery wrapped in an enigma, and then - garnished with shaving cream!

[JoePerri]

Ok, here is the reply that Feather gave to classic:


“As attached photos, we used to have these 2 designs of double edge blade.

We distinguished depending on the item type at that time.

But, we unified these 2 designs to 1 design, which was "Trade Mark" (right photo of your attached file) on the blade in 1989.

From then on, we have had only 1 design of double edge blade, which has "Trade Mark" on it.

Since this unification was done in 1989, we are sort of surprised that the double edge blade with discontinued design has been still circulated in your market.”

So Feather seems to be saying the the blade on the left in the pic, the "NeW Hi-Stainless" is the OLDER blade, dating from 1989 or earlier!! Seems odd but who knows? The "NeW Hi-Stainless" blade came from a sampler pack and I find it difficult to believe that they have been sitting on a shelf for 18 years.

The question now is can some of our European members who use Feather please take a look at your blades and post which kind you have and when you bought them? It would be very helpful to try and get this straight.


Joe

[Belegnole]

Oh, just great ... the blades I liked the most from the sample pack are 18 or more years old. Guess they're like fine wine and improve with age.....

I'm SO confused

[Gafer]

I stumbled on to this some time back:
http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=18903

I thought at the time that maybe I had been sold counterfeit blades but now it appears I was just sold "old" blades. As they say, if a deal seems too good to be true then it probably isn't a deal. Perhaps Cotton Blossom just came into some old blades back when they were still selling them?

That said, the response from Feather is kind of odd in that the New Hi-stainless is actually the old blade. Now I'm confused and sitting on about 75 Feather's that may or may not be 18 years old...


I did the same yesterday so we'll see what we hear back. Luckily I still have 4 10-packs of the clear plastic outer case variety and the blades in those say platinum on them so I'm not in a hurry just yet. I e-mailed CAR at Enchante to ask him and he was not familiar with the non-platinum Feather blade.

-Collin

The blade at the top in my previous post mentioned above was purchased at Enchante back in May of this year. I never noticed that the blade doesn't say anything about being platinum coated. I don't have the wrappers any more but I'm certain they mentioned a platinum coating.

[JoePerri]

I have received a reply directly from Feather:



Dear Mr. Perrigoue,

Thank you very much for your e-mail dated November 16, 2007.

In reply to your question, please be advised that we had both types of
Double Edge blades according to our item numbers around until the year 1988.
However, around the year 1988, we united the design into one type, with
feaher illustration.
In other words, only the right side blade in your attached picture in
your e-mail dated November 16 is available now.

We hope this will answer your question.
As we asked you in our previous e-mail, we will appreciate it if you let us
know where you are located (your country) so that we can give you our
distributor's contact information.

Best Regards,

FEATHER SAFETY RAZOR CO., LTD.
Ayako Fujiwara, Overseas Trade Division

This confirms what classic was told.


So here is how it seems to break down:

Hi-Stainless These are the older blades that came in the black and gray package. They are not platinum coated and are no longer produced.

NeW Platinum Hi-Stainless These are platinum coated blades that were produced along with the non-platinum blades back in the 80's. They have "Platinum Coated Blade" and "NeW HI-STAINLESS" printed on the blade. They do not have the Feather logo or "TRADE MARK" printed on them. They were discontinued along with the non-platinum blades in 1988.

Platinum Hi-Stainless These are the current production platinum coated blades in the new yellow & red package BUT with the old style printing on the blade. These are only available in the US from http://classicshaving.com, who have excellent customer service and have been VERY patient and responsive in helping to figure this out.



That seems to be the whole picture!

I have completed my single blind comparison of the old non-platinum blade versus the current production platinum coated blade. I will write up a summary and post it tomorrow along with pictures and before and after micrographs of both types of blades.

Thank you all very much for you help in getting this sorted out!

Joe

[scoopster]

I've just finished one of these older non-Platinum High Stainless blades from a batch I got from Pauldog. Here are my first impressions:

A caveat - this is only from three shaves with one blade. I need to use a few more blades before I would say my experience is definitive.


Used this blade three times, then discarded. That is what I ususally get from a Platinum Feather (sometimes two, four of five shaves but usualy the number is three, three being the number...).
This did not feel as sharp as any of the Platinum Feathers I've used. The blade did feel sharper than the IP's and Derbys. I regularly use Derby/IP so for me the difference was pretty noticable.
This blade provided excellent shaves with no harshness. Note that I have mixed experiences with the Platinum blades. Sometimes a Platinum blade will provide great shaves, sometimes a blade will be very harsh on my skin for every shave and I'll ususally bail on it after two.

I didn't mind that this blade was not as sharp as Platinum Feathers; the shaves were great. I am going to keep using them and if they consistently provide shaves like the blade I just used I'll be happy camper.
I just finished using my second Hi-Stainless blade.

At this point I still think they are sharper than Derby/IP's but not as sharp as the Platinum Hi-Stainless blades I've used in the past (to get the terminology more correct over my previous post).

With the second blade I tried, my first two shaves were pretty rough (neck bumps). These were rushed shaves due to two hectic mornings in a row. I have these kinds of rushed shaves with Derby & IP's periodically and those two blades are more forgiving than the Hi-Stainless Feather was when I'm "bending" my technique a bit due to haste & stress. If I used the Platinum Hi-Stainless under these conditions my face wouldn't have stood a chance - I just don't go there.

The third shave with this blade was more relaxed and I didn't get a single bump or any signs of rash. I did get some nicks. I think this was because I did three passes and a LOT of touch up, going for BBS everywhere. I was using QED Wild Rose soap and enjoying the shave so much I didn't want it to end. So again I think on this third use of blade number 2 the nicks were due to many passes and the blade getting a little tired.

At this point I would say that to get the Ninja sharp Feathers go for the newest Feathers. But I have enough variability in my product rotations and shaving conditions that I generally need to benchmark something a lot more (say, ten blades) to be definitive. Stay tuned.

I'm very interested to hear Joe(JoePerri's) blind comparison results as it sounds like he has really been digging into this whole multiple Feather thing. Big time Cudos to Joe for all that research and very enlightening posts! Thank you!

[Pauldog]

It's likely that the blades I have in the cartons of 250 are not platinum. The cartons are taped shut, but the tape is so old that it comes loose when you touch it.

By the way, the 10-packs from LetterK and Cotton Blossom were from the same place I got them, and were marked "NeW Hi-Stainless". LetterK's are now probably going to be marked "Hi-Stainless", but still platinum.

[joch]

Is this the same blade that classicshaving is selling?
http://www.razorandbrush.com/feat.JPG
Joch





I have received a reply directly from Feather:



This confirms what classic was told.


So here is how it seems to break down:

Hi-Stainless These are the older blades that came in the black and gray package. They are not platinum coated and are no longer produced.

NeW Platinum Hi-Stainless These are platinum coated blades that were produced along with the non-platinum blades back in the 80's. They have "Platinum Coated Blade" and "NeW HI-STAINLESS" printed on the blade. They do not have the Feather logo or "TRADE MARK" printed on them. They were discontinued along with the non-platinum blades in 1988.

Platinum Hi-Stainless These are the current production platinum coated blades in the new yellow & red package BUT with the old style printing on the blade. These are only available in the US from http://classicshaving.com, who have excellent customer service and have been VERY patient and responsive in helping to figure this out.



That seems to be the whole picture!

I have completed my single blind comparison of the old non-platinum blade versus the current production platinum coated blade. I will write up a summary and post it tomorrow along with pictures and before and after micrographs of both types of blades.

Thank you all very much for you help in getting this sorted out!

Joe

[JoePerri]

Now that we have established which blade is which, we now need to know if there are any differences. The manufacturer states that the newer blades are platinum coated while the older blade is not. This is the only claimed difference. What I have done is put several of the blades under my microscope to see what differences are visible. Unfortunately I don't have access to research quality instruments, just my little toy USB microscope. All images are 640x480, taken under a mix of artificial and natural light. I know there are scientists and others on this board with access to very nice instruments, perhaps one of them might like to lend a hand. I'd be happy to send blades anywhere in the world.

Here is the first blade. This is the older non-platinum blade at 60x:
http://lh4.google.com/JoePerrigoue/R0SIxdNOs5I/AAAAAAAAAFk/wmi0O2ouemo/s800/Feather%20Old%20Blade%2060x.jpg

We can see a few things. First a wide primary bevel with fairly coarse grind marks, then a small secondary bevel with a fine surface. The edge appears straight and undamaged. The secondary bevel is the irregular brownish band near the edge. Looks good.

Here is the second blade. This is the current production platinum coated blade.
http://lh4.google.com/JoePerrigoue/R0SIxdNOs7I/AAAAAAAAAF0/d_Rs5eYr7f4/s800/Feather%20Plat%2060x.jpg

Right away we can see a major difference. The blade has a much more specular appearance. It does seem to be coated in some kind of reflective metal. This should be the platinum coating. Both images were taken under identical lighting so the difference is on the blade. We can also observe a small primary bevel with a coarser grind. The secondary bevel is also smaller and less visible. There seems to be a hint of a tertiary bevel as well. To me this clearly shows a difference in coating as well as in grinding(sharpening).


Here is the older non-platinum blade at 200x.
http://lh4.google.com/JoePerrigoue/R0SIxdNOs6I/AAAAAAAAAFs/78-y3ZgFnvw/s800/Feather%20Old%20Blade%20200x.jpg

This shows both bevels clearly. The scratches from the primary bevel are ground away with a much finer abrasive in the secondary bevel leaving scratches too small for my microscope to resolve. Note the lack of any "wire edge" or other blade defects. This is a well sharpened blade.

Here is the platinum coated blade at 200x.
http://lh4.google.com/JoePerrigoue/R0SIxdNOs8I/AAAAAAAAAF8/NRhpopAmXu8/s800/Feather%20Plat%20200x.jpg

Now we can see a real difference. The scratches(grind marks) on the primary bevel are coarser. This is fine because the cutting edge is not formed by the primary bevel. We can then see the secondary bevel and that it is also formed with a coarser abrasive BUT there is clearly a third or tertiary bevel! This is a very small bevel and has been formed with very, very fine abrasives. So fine that it appears black because the marks are smaller than the shortest wavelength of the light I'm using. This is a VERY sharp edge!


So what does this mean? Well, the difference between the two blades are this: The newer blades are platinum coated AND sharpened using a different system. The new blades seem to have a more refined, sharper edge as well.


Now the question is can one feel a difference in the blades? After all any additional sharpness or new coatings mean nothing if they don't impact the shaving experience in some way.

To test this I enlisted my wife to help me with a blind experiment with both blades. First I obtained matching 1959 Gillette Fat Boy adjustable razors. Then I had my wife mark one blade with permanent ink and then load one of each kind of blade into the razors, not telling me which blade was in which razor. I then shaved with each for eight days total, alternating razors each day. At no point did I open the doors and look at the blades. I then repeated the experiment with fresh blades but had her reverse which blade was in which razor to try to avergae out any differences in the razors themselves. On the ninth day of the second trial I used both razors, one on each side of my face. I kept notes during both trials and wrote down my conclusions before I had her reveal the blades. This was all done before I looked at the blades under the microscope.

So what did I find?

There is a difference in feel between the blades. I chose the current production platinum blade in both trials. There was a clear difference. The platinum blade was smoother with less pulling. There was NO difference in closeness or irritation. Both blades gave very close shaves with no real irritation.

How big is the difference in feel? Small. While it is noticeable it is not a huge difference. The new blades cost approximately $.75 each, the older blades from Paul about $.25. Is the difference worth three times the price? No way. Of course once Paul's are gone, they're gone! I bought 350 from him and will happily use them for the next few years. However, if you want the most comfortable shave possible from a Feather blade you must use the new sharper platinum coated blade.


Hope this helps,
Joe

[BarryR]

Now that we have established which blade is which, we now need to know if there are any differences...

Nice job! I was going to do a randomized blind test myself, but haven't yet. Did you 'guess' which blade was which after each shave, or just once at the end?

[JoePerri]

Nice job! I was going to do a randomized blind test myself, but haven't yet. Did you 'guess' which blade was which after each shave, or just once at the end?

I tried not to guess which one was which. I just kept notes and tried to keep an open mind.

Joe

[BarryR]

I tried not to guess which one was which. I just kept notes and tried to keep an open mind.

JoeI was thinking about a statistical analysis, so what I meant was, did you form any conclusions on each day as a separate trial (as in, razor 'A' feels sharper today) or just one conclusion at the end of each of the two trials?

[JoePerri]

I see what you mean. I did not keep track of any change in each blade over time, just the difference between them. I think they both dropped equally in performance over time. The smoother blade started that way and stayed that way.

Joe

[duckintheface]

I'm afraid I have to challenge your single blind methodology Joe. Clearly, your wife... who knew which blade was which.... was stroking your clean shaven face more on the days when you used the platinum coated blades. This influened your conclusions regarding the superiority of the new blades.....

nawwhh... just kidding. I'm very impressed with your dedication and complete obsession with the goal of getting the best shave life has to offer.

[scoopster]

Just wanted to check back in on this thread. I was having much more consistent results with Pauldog's old stock Feathers. For me they were noticably less sharp but much smoother than the Platinum ones.

I've used a few more of these blades and have mixed results, some really smooth and nice while a few were pretty rough on my face. I recently switched razors which definitley has some bearing in my analysis (Merkur 38C to a Vision 2000). Overall I think these old stock Feathers are smoother but I still have an occasional one that yields a rough shave. I continue to experience that these NOS Feathers do seem to last longer for me. Platinum Feathers: 2 shaves, occasionally 3 shaves. NOS Stainless Feathers: 4 sometines even 5 shaves.

[TstebinsB]

For those of you interested in the DE blades, this is from my friend in Japan:


As for the feather blades, I talked with Feather Japan directly. Here's their story. Both blades are same. When Feather's hi-stainless blade came into the market in US, the package was designed with the name "New hi-stainless". And Feather Japan was requested to put the word "New" on the blade surface by the US distributors. It means one product had two kinds of the design. It had continued till around ten years ago. Now their production procedure was rationalized, and they're manufacturing only one design i.e. the blade of the right side. The current blade exported to US is same with the one for the Japanese market i.e. the right side one. I hope it explains all. If you have any further query, please ask me freely. Thank you.

[michael m]

Great job....now I will start to see if I can tell a difference .

[JoePerri]

If you can work out a way to do a blind test, I'd be very interested to hear your findings.

Joe

[JayKay]

I was reading somewhere not to long ago that all the new feathers produced are the same. They just write new on them and send them to america. But all the blades produced by feather now are exactly the same.

[TstebinsB]

I was reading somewhere not to long ago that all the new feathers produced are the same. They just write new on them and send them to america. But all the blades produced by feather now are exactly the same.

Look up to my post..

[JoePerri]

Sigh... :rolleyes:

If only someone would make a detailed study of this and then create a long detailed thread with all the pertinent information including direct correspondence with the US distributor and manufacturer......

Joe

[TstebinsB]

Sigh... :rolleyes:

If only someone would make a detailed study of this and then create a long detailed thread with all the pertinent information including direct correspondence with the US distributor and manufacturer......

Joe

Looking over your study, you said Feather said the newer blade is platinum-coated but not the older one? That's not what they've told me. You are correct that they use a different sharpening system for their blades. As technology has improved, so has the method of sharpening. However, both blades are platinum-coated.

[JoePerri]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:



Hi-Stainless These are the older blades that came in the black and gray package. They are not platinum coated and are no longer produced.

NeW Platinum Hi-Stainless These are platinum coated blades that were produced along with the non-platinum blades back in the 80's. They have "Platinum Coated Blade" and "NeW HI-STAINLESS" printed on the blade. They do not have the Feather logo or "TRADE MARK" printed on them. They were discontinued along with the non-platinum blades in 1988.

Platinum Hi-Stainless These are the current production platinum coated blades in the new yellow & red package BUT with the old style printing on the blade. These are only available in the US from http://classicshaving.com, who have excellent customer service and have been VERY patient and responsive in helping to figure this out.


There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

[TstebinsB]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:



There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

When you wrote "The manufacturer states that the newer blades are platinum coated while the older blade is not," I didn't know you were talking about two different newer blades. My fault for not looking through the whole thing.

[Pauldog]

Now I'm not sure which blade I have. I know it's older, but it may or may not have the platinum coating. It must use the older sharpening method, though.

[Gafer]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:



There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

This should be posted up in the Wiki. Thanks for the summary. I too was confused by all the posts.

[TENroaches]

Does anyone know if the 250 lot on eBay is platinum-coated or not? Maybe by the carton it comes in? It's not a live auction, just a store, so I think I can link to it.

http://cgi.ebay.com/250-FEATHER-HI-STAINLESS-DOUBLE-EDGE-RAZOR-BLADES_W0QQitemZ270246214971QQihZ017QQcategoryZ887 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Thanks

[JoePerri]

Does anyone know if the 250 lot on eBay is platinum-coated or not? Maybe by the carton it comes in? It's not a live auction, just a store, so I think I can link to it.

http://cgi.ebay.com/250-FEATHER-HI-STAINLESS-DOUBLE-EDGE-RAZOR-BLADES_W0QQitemZ270246214971QQihZ017QQcategoryZ887 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Thanks

Those are being sold by Pauldog, a member here. They are the older blades. See my blind test above for the differences.

Joe

[TENroaches]

Those are being sold by Pauldog, a member here. They are the older blades. See my blind test above for the differences.

Joe

Read the whole thread, so that explains it. My friend and I are after some Feathers like the ones we used in the sampler, which would be with platinum. I guess the only option is Classic Shaving.

[BarryR]

I bought 250 from Pauldog just when we all became aware that there were two different kinds of Feathers. After initially thinking I liked the newer ones better, I decided I wasn't sure. Now about 9 months later, I'm still not sure, and I'm glad I bought them. Many (probably myself included) think the newer ones may be a little sharper but the older ones a little smoother.

He'll probably selll you a smaller quantity if you want to just try them first and then decide.

[Pauldog]

You can get one blade, if that's all you want. They're $.25 each and a flat $1.50 for shipping any quantity.

[FatboySlim]

I bought 250 from Pauldog just when we all became aware that there were two different kinds of Feathers. After initially thinking I liked the newer ones better, I decided I wasn't sure. Now about 9 months later, I'm still not sure, and I'm glad I bought them.

I have both Pauldog's bulk 250 and 100 of the newer boxed Feathers from Classic Shaving, and I agree. Just when I think there's a difference, I try the other and get a great shave with either one. They're both Feathers, both certainly shave like Feathers and nothing else, and both are top-notch. The only difference I've seen is that the new Feathers sometimes last one extra shave for me, but not consistently.

Yet, the most shaves I've ever gotten from one DE blade was from one of Pauldog's Feathers, in my slant. Six solid shaves. I must've been on my game, or somebody had a good day at the factory, because normally my limit is three, with either type. Four if I push it, and I generally don't.

[TENroaches]

I have both Pauldog's bulk 250 and 100 of the newer boxed Feathers from Classic Shaving, and I agree. Just when I think there's a difference, I try the other and get a great shave with either one. They're both Feathers, both certainly shave like Feathers and nothing else, and both are top-notch. The only difference I've seen is that the new Feathers sometimes last one extra shave for me, but not consistently.

Yet, the most shaves I've ever gotten from one DE blade was from one of Pauldog's Feathers, in my slant. Six solid shaves. I must've been on my game, or somebody had a good day at the factory, because normally my limit is three, with either type. Four if I push it, and I generally don't.

Do you change a blade as soon as you realize you're pushin' it (after your first stroke), or do you complete the shave that's not so good and change it before the next? I thought you'd always want to just change it every so many shaves so that you don't actually let it get to the point where it's not good. It's too much trouble to change a blade mid-shave or to suffer a tugging shave.

[FatboySlim]

Do you change a blade as soon as you realize you're pushin' it (after your first stroke), or do you complete the shave that's not so good and change it before the next? I thought you'd always want to just change it every so many shaves so that you don't actually let it get to the point where it's not good. It's too much trouble to change a blade mid-shave or to suffer a tugging shave.

I've changed blades a few times right in the middle of a shave, after a few strokes. Usually it doesn't help - if it's that bad for me, it really means I'm just having a "bad shave" day, and my technique is off. A marginal blade will feel like a cheese grater, and even a fresh blade will feel much rougher. I stop at two passes, skipping my ATG pass. Still very presentable. Next day, the very same blade will often feel just fine, it was me who improved.

Usually, I change blades based on the memory of my last shave. I know a blade is "going" when the first two passes are good, but my ATG pass on my neck noticeably skips or drags and requires pressure to get results. Blades are relatively cheap, and I know that if I try to "push" one more complete 3-pass shave with a blade that is past it's prime, my neck will pay for it with irritation on the ATG pass. Not worth it to me. When a blade doesn't glide for me anymore, it goes. Sometimes it's just me, usually it's the blade.

[p.lawrence]

A simple question, are the NOS feather blades the second best blades available today? yes? or no?

[scoopster]

A simple question, are the NOS feather blades the second best blades available today? yes? or no?

I think that is a hard question to answer.

If you want the sharpest blade possible I would stick with the new feathers (that is at least my experience between the old and new Feathers).

I found the older Feathers to be much more forgiving and last longer than than the newer ones (but nowhere near as sharp). I would put the NOS Feathers as sharper than IP's and Derby's which I use regularly but they are also more expensive than those two. So you gotta try a few and decide for yourself. Pauldog is pretty flexible in terms of how many he will sell you. Good luck.

[SilverKarn]

When my dad went to thailand i asked him to buy me some razor blades that he might find in stores, he brought back some Astras, Gillettes, and Feather blades.

I thought the Feather blades were fakes because the packaging was totally different than the yellow insert that i always see. Reading this topic made me go open the pack of blades to see if they are the real thing, as soon as i took the carboard insert out i realized that they are real Feathers, since they have the white waxwrap with blue feathers on it, and the blade has the feather icon on it.

The next time he goes to Thailand i'm going to ask him to pick me up a box of 250 or two next time he goes.

[DSB]

After reading this very thorough discussion, I thought an additional link might help some people out:

http://www.excedrin.com

[tlanning]

member pureslab is selling the new feathers on the buy and sell forum. I bought 100 from him 2 nites ago. He swears they are exactly the same!!!!! (only black in 5 packs) Hes been selling them in Thailand for years.
He also states the reason there not being sold in the US as of yet is that the "distributor" had to buy millions plus and needs to run out of the old ones! (the distributor packages the blades)
Hope this helps:thumbup:

cheers

[tlanning]

Just a quick update.

I have heard back from classic. There seems to be some confusion. Classic claims that Feather told them that the blades with the old style printing(the blade on the right in the pic up top) have not been made since the late 80's. That makes sense for the blades from Paul but NOT for the blades from classic! If that is true then classic is selling old blades. I don't think that is the case though. I think there has just been a mis-communication between classic and the guys in Japan or classic is just blowing me off with a tall tale and hoping I don't care. I've emailed the pic back to classic and asked them to confirm what they have been told. If I don't get an answer soon my plan is to have a guy I know in Japan investigate. I'll have him buy some blades locally, take pics and then call & email Feather for an explanation. Since he is fluent in Japanese I expect he will get a better answer.

Joe

As I said, pure slab is in thailand. He states the US distributors have millions of blades in old stock. See for yourself
http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=93970:biggrin:

For what its worth I didn't know about Pauldog when I bought these the other nite, I found pureslap on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=160340718925

He had a 99&#37; with over 1700 sales in Thailand, so I bought some, sorry pauldog, hes since raised his shipping price $5 to $7.5 on the bay still $35 here but $10 higher than yours

cheers

[tlanning]

After reading this very thorough discussion, I thought an additional link might help some people out:

http://www.excedrin.com

:jump::a21: +1

[Pureslab]

I have been banging these blades out like a Catholic Schoolgirl on Prom Night


So here is a mini comparison of what are essentially the exact same blade


http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu176/thailand666/DSC00407.jpg

I think here in Asia these are used more often and more frequently then say back in USA hence the availability - above you will notice the two types of packaging in question


The yellow box can still be found here in some places that are holding old stock - I ask one place to dig around for me and they pulled out a few.

Otherwise it is the Red & White Box that is currently stocked and sold

http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu176/thailand666/DSC00408.jpg


Packaging of the blades

http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu176/thailand666/DSC00409.jpg

Unwrapping the packaging reveals the same blade ???

http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu176/thailand666/DSC00410.jpg

The Saga Continues

http://i645.photobucket.com/albums/uu176/thailand666/DSC00411.jpg

Hope this helps

[Mr-Scruffy]

They really know how to confuse things.

[htownmmm]

They really know how to confuse things.

Thankfully our source is close enough to the land of the rising sun to investigate w/o going out of his way.

$35 shipped is a great price on a 100 pack of Feathers; I had noticed that other blades which are close in sharpness had been creeping up in pricing since Feathers were no longer able to be bought in the 100 packs. This should help stabilize the market somewhat.


marty

[TimMechEngr]

I have been banging these blades out like a Catholic Schoolgirl on Prom Night


So here is a mini comparison of what are essentially the exact same blade




Thanks for this photo comparison.

[Gafer]

Feathers' are now in a black package? Now I'm confused again.

http://bullgooseshaving.net/fehideblcof1.html
or
http://www.classicshaving.com/catalog/item/522941/7503978.htm

Are these the same as the original yellow packaging?

[slickster514]

The yellow and blacks are the same blade, and they are both platinum coated. In fact, they only currently manufacture 1 grade of blade regardless of the exterior packaging. This has been probably answered before, I apologize. I went as far as emailing the Feather Co. and got a response confirming this.

However, there is one guy selling the black stock from Singapore, it is possible that this is old stock because the underside of the cardboard inserts were beginning to tarnish. Just blades perform just the same though. I have learnt that the current stock has a bar code sticker on the outside plastic wrap of each pack, and a lot number stamped on each individual pack. Ntguys on eBay has the freshest stock to my knowledge.

[Bulldawg]

This whole issue is confusing to me and I guess it's a YMMV type thing. I have used yellow packs of 10 Feathers exclusively for the past year. I purchased the 5 pack of Feathers in the black pack a few months ago, tried several of the blades, and they didn't perform as well as the yellow packs of 10 even though the overwhelming majority of folks say they're the same :huh: Hopefully I'm wrong here and it was some type of placebo effect because my understanding is the yellow 10 packs are no longer being produced.

[Gafer]

The yellow and blacks are the same blade, and they are both platinum coated. In fact, they only currently manufacture 1 grade of blade regardless of the exterior packaging. This has been probably answered before, I apologize. I went as far as emailing the Feather Co. and got a response confirming this.

However, there is one guy selling the black stock from Singapore, it is possible that this is old stock because the underside of the cardboard inserts were beginning to tarnish. Just blades perform just the same though. I have learnt that the current stock has a bar code sticker on the outside plastic wrap of each pack, and a lot number stamped on each individual pack. Ntguys on eBay has the freshest stock to my knowledge.

I've purchased from ntguys before and was very satisfied with the product and speed so I may go there when I need a refill on Feather's.


This whole issue is confusing to me and I guess it's a YMMV type thing. I have used yellow packs of 10 Feathers exclusively for the past year. I purchased the 5 pack of Feathers in the black pack a few months ago, tried several of the blades, and they didn't perform as well as the yellow packs of 10 even though the overwhelming majority of folks say they're the same :huh: Hopefully I'm wrong here and it was some type of placebo effect because my understanding is the yellow 10 packs are no longer being produced.

Bulldawg, I hope you're wrong. I have 100 Feather's from the Yellow packs and then I'm out. I shave with Derby's through the winter - my dry winter skin can't take a Feather shave every day so I'm good for awhile but if the new ones aren't the same I may have to go on a quest but nothing beats a Feather.

[shamus]

Try starting from the first post and then reading all the subsequent posts. They are all written in a pretty clear manner. That should clear it right up for you. For the terminally impatient you might skip right to this bit:



There was a very old non-platinum blade. When they started making platinum coated blades they switched to two different blade markings. They have since unified the markings to be consistent. I, personally, have spoken directly with the manufacturer about this several times.

Joe

Thank you Joe and the rest of the contributors for sorting out this difference in the blades. I had used 10 Feathers in the Yellow Pack, from WCS and then had received a 5 Blade Pack of the "Old Stock" Feather's in the Gray pack. To me there was a noticeable difference in the comfort level of the two types of Blades. The Older Stock Blades in the Gray Pack of 5 were rougher. I had just ordered, via the Bay, 50 Feathers in the Yellow Pack. After I placed my order and paid, the vendor stated that he had run out of the Yellow Pack blades and would substitute the Gray pack Blades to make up the 50 blade order, along with a pack of Blue Birds. I told the vendor, NO DICE, I ordered the 50 in 5 Packs of 10 and that is what was advertised. The vendor then complied and e-mailed me that he would send the 50 blades in 5 packs of 10 in the yellow pack. I guess there are some vendors who are trying to unload old stock that they picked up for a song by substituting the Old for the New. The Old stock that was going to be sent, and I refused had the Feather trademark on the blades. Without your help, along with the other posters who contributed, I would have received Old Stock stainless blades without the platinum coating and using the old grind method. There was a noticeable difference for me between the two types of Feather blades. Thank you again for the fine work and help. Cheers.

[mwhals]

Dang! I bought my first DE razor and a 10 pack of Merkur and a 10 pack of Feather Platinum blades on October 16, 2009 from classicshaving.

My feather blades had the platinum packing with the yellow cardboard and white plastic case. I just realized that the blades all say "Hi-Stainless" on them and none of them have the word "platinum" on them.

Apparently as late at October 2009, classicshaving is still selling the older blades in the newer packaging.

Mark

[shamus]

You have the newer blades if they are packaged in the white box with the Yellow and Red lettering with black. If they have the Feather Trademark and the Yellow pack is marked Platinum then you have the newer blades. Try to read the post from the beginning.

If you had the black pack of 5 blades with the Feather trademark and H-Stainless on the blade then you would have the Non-Platinum coated blades using the older grind method.

If you had the black pack with "New Hi-Stainless, Platinum on the blade without the trademark...Then you would have Platinum Blades. No problem if you wanted platinum coated blades with the new grind method.

[mwhals]

You have the newer blades if they are packaged in the white box with the Yellow and Red lettering with black. If they have the Feather Trademark and the Yellow pack is marked Platinum then you have the newer blades. Try to read the post from the beginning.

If you had the black pack of 5 blades with the Feather trademark and H-Stainless on the blade then you would have the Non-Platinum coated blades using the older grind method.

If you had the black pack with "New Hi-Stainless, Platinum on the blade without the trademark...Then you would have Platinum Blades. No problem if you wanted platinum coated blades with the new grind method.


I did read it from the beginning. I saw where old stock has to be used in America. My blade simply looks like the second one in the original poster's picture. Not that it really matters, because I am thinking about trying Derby next.

Edit: I must have missed it the first time, but I saw where the second picture in the original poster's post is the newest blade, which is what mine looks like. As a result I am using the newer blade.


Mark

[shamus]

Well, if you had read the long post from the beginning you would be aware that there are 3 types of Feather Blades out on the Market.

One of the blades is only Hi-Stainless without Platinum using the old grind method.

Another blade was used in the transition phase and is New Hi-Stainless, Platinum Coated, ground using the New Method and this blade would be missing the Feather Trademark.

The final blade, would be the Feather in the white box, With the Yellow, Black and Red colors and the package would be marked Hi Stainless, Platinum blades. This is the current blade and is Platinum coated, Hi-Stainless, using the New grind method and WOULD have the Feather logo/trademark on the blade.

Cheers!:thumbup:

[vincent]

One thing about the longevity of the NOS that I bought from Pauldog (unfortunately on another forum). They are very sharp, very smooth and consistently last a week. I now make an habit of changing every Saturday morning. It is easier for an old guy to do thing once a week, I guess. I get a BBS shave just as easily on the 7th day. After trying close to 35 different kinds of blade, I felt that this was the one, even better than the New Feather. I bought a box of 250. At one blade a week, I am now set for five years. Variety mostly come from my soaps now.

[Mr B]

Well done! Thank you for an EXCELLENT post!

[ezlovan]

Holy schnikees what a post. I'm so glad I found this before I bought my next 100 pack.....

[hedonist222]

Very informative.

Over here in the UAE we have the black, gray and white box.

Apparently I am shaving with 24 year old blades. Thats more than half my age.