Let us try to put a date to a #21 shall we??

[Henrik]

I was rather courious why not anyone has tried to put a fairly accurate production date on the Aristocrat #21. I don´t own a #15 but it seems to be a common consensus that both razors shares the same design of the head. It is also a common consensus that the #15 was introduced in 1938.
Looking at Mr. Razors) site (great of course) his #21 is nailed down to 1948.. I found that rather odd. Surely this razor was put into production much earlier?? Sure a razor can be manufactured for a span of a decade (or more) but when was the #21 first came in the manufacturing line?

Well, based on below thread it was suggested that the closed comb- or the introduction of the safety bar saw the light of the world around 1940/41 (at least by Gillette).
http://badgerandblade.com/vb/archive/index.php/t-86023.html

My suggestion is that the #21 was introduced somewhere around there- around 1940-1941. Gillette just conveniently kept the design of the head of the fairly new #15 and introduced the safety bar- and alas the #21 was born.
What do you think? .. Any early ads that may enlighten us someone?

An other question that may still is troublesome to answer is why Gillette did in fact mark the early British Aristocrats with patent numbers and then abandod this labelling in the 50`s and for a while just labelled them with "patent pending".
A suggestion there may be that that the were some dispute with the Americans and the British over the patents and the Brits of juridicinal reasons just had to mark them as "pending".
Any thoughts?

[insomniac]

Any thoughts?

The Brits were fairly busy with other endeavors between the end of the '30s and the mid-40s, which may be why there is a long gap between the #15 and the #21.

[mr-razor]

the only date information I have is this australian 1948 price list. But maybe he comes earlier:

http://www.mr-razor.com/Preislisten/1948 Price list Australia-01.jpg

[Henrik]

Well, the war is over in `45 if you implie on the this suggestion.

The Brits were fairly busy with other endeavors between the end of the '30s and the mid-40s, which may be why there is a long gap between the #15 and the #21.

[missingskin]

Well, the war is over in `45 if you implie on the this suggestion.

The war may have been over but we were still in a bit of a state. Shortages of most metals, factories destroyed, Homes destroyed, rationing and the country on its knees........the end of the fighting is not the end of the war?

[Henrik]

True indeed. From what I know the Brits (and I presume most of Europe) had rations on such as things as butter and other neccesities well into the 50´s. But please can´t we get back into the #21- my original question?? The dating of the #21. And for a while suggest that the patent pending is due to the cause of the war- however this "pending" last well into the 60´s. Well overdue if I may say so. "You never had it so good" claimed by primeminister Harold Macmillan in 1957..


The war may have been over but we were still in a bit of a state. Shortages of most metals, factories destroyed, Homes destroyed, rationing and the country on its knees........the end of the fighting is not the end of the war?

[insomniac]

True indeed. From what I know the Brits (and I presume most of Europe) had rations on such as things as butter and other neccesities well into the 50´s. But please can´t we get back into the #21- my original question?? The dating of the #21. And for a while suggest that the patent pending is due to the cause of the war- however this "pending" last well into the 60´s. Well overdue if I may say so. "You never had it so good" claimed by primeminister Harold Macmillan in 1957..

I don't think anyone is claiming the razors weren't made until the '50s. But you gave a date of '40-41 when Britain was assuredly at war. Even the US which started production of the original TTO solid guard razors in 1940-41 didn't bring these razors back until 1946 with the Ranger Tech, and that saw pretty limited production, from a country which didn't suffer from rocket attacks and bombings on the mainland. So it's reasonable to think that the British Gillette factory wouldn't have started producing something like the #21 until '46-47, which matches nicely with Achim's date.

[mr-razor]

... and 1948 comes the first #48 Aristocrat jr (http://www.mr-razor.com/Werbung/C%201948%20No44,%20No48,%20No77%20England.jpg). Set, 1949 the #16 and #22 (http://www.mr-razor.com/Werbung/C%201949%20Aristocrat%20No16,%20No22.jpg)
it looks like the beginning of the rhodium plated solid guard bar razors

[Henrik]

That is a sugestion that I would buy insominac. And for the butter stuff I already mentioned, I did mean really the whole damn infrastructure that was included as well- if some of you guys felt insulted in some way.

[missingskin]

True indeed. From what I know the Brits (and I presume most of Europe) had rations on such as things as butter and other neccesities well into the 50´s. But please can´t we get back into the #21- my original question?? The dating of the #21. And for a while suggest that the patent pending is due to the cause of the war- however this "pending" last well into the 60´s. Well overdue if I may say so. "You never had it so good" claimed by primeminister Harold Macmillan in 1957..

ok I will take an educated guess......
1. Patent Pending was cheap way of slowing down or stopping another company from copying your design. To get a patent approved you had to apply to the Patent Office and depending on their decision it was granted and you were charged for it. This could take time, hence pending?
2. During the war years most things (like razors) were just made for purpose so a lot of Techs/Tech style razors were made for the military and civilian use. Luxury goods (like the Aristocrat range) were put on hold as there was not a market for them. So give it a few years after the war to recover both economically and manufacturing then you get more "luxury" items hitting the market.
This may explain why it took so long for the follow up to the #15 ?

[MacDaddy]

An other question that may still is troublesome to answer is why Gillette did in fact mark the early British Aristocrats with patent numbers and then abandod this labelling in the 50`s and for a while just labelled them with "patent pending".
A suggestion there may be that that the were some dispute with the Americans and the British over the patents and the Brits of juridicinal reasons just had to mark them as "pending".
Any thoughts?

This part is a much more straightforward question to answer. Patents expire, and it's against the law to mark products with expired patents as it gives the impression that they are still protected. This is why the American Old Types after 1921 stop carrying the patent date inscription, for example.

The earlier patent, GB430030, was a recognition of US1956175 -- Gillette's original TTO design patent filed in August of 1933. The filing date in the UK was December 12, 1933. I'm no patent attorney, but I believe even then the duration of a patent in the UK was 20 years from the filing date, which would mean that GB430030 would have expired in 1953. The "Patent Pending" stamp, however, refers to GB694093. This was the patent on the notched center bar and Speed-Pak designs. That patent was filed in the United States on December 10, 1947 (issued July 24, 1951 as US2562115) and in the UK on Dec 11, 1948 but wasn't issued until July 15, 1953. During the time that the patent was under consideration Gillette was permitted to use the "Patent Pending" inscription to alert competitors of their intent to defend the design against infringement.

So, assuming that I've got my timeline correct, here's what we can tell from that:


No razor made after 1953 should bear the "430,030" stamp, as the patent would have expired.
No razor made before 1953 should bear the "694,093" stamp, as the patent wasn't issued till then.
Razors made between 1948 and 1953 that had notched center bars could appear with either the "430,030" or the "Patent Pending" stamps. My best guess to the logic here would be razors made from parts that Gillette would have tooled for prior to the notched designs would be more likely to stay stamped "430,030" (e.g., Aristocrat Juniors with the flat base plate (http://mr-razor.com/Rasierer/One-Piece%20solid%20guard%20bar/1949%20%28U2%29%20Aristocrat%20jr.JPG)). But razors that used newer designed parts would be more likely to carry the "Patent Pending" stamp (e.g., No.22 Aristocrats with diamond-shaped base plate (http://mr-razor.com/Rasierer/One-Piece%20solid%20guard%20bar/1949%20Aristocrat%20No22.JPG)).