Belgian Security Team

[LittleLebowski]

Belgian rifle (FN FAL 7.62x51mm) and Belgian Malinois dog (name is Nacho).

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/IMG_0752.jpg

[Old AF SP]

Both look like they have attitude to spare when the situation warrants. Thanks for sharing!

[Rossmeister]

I'd love to try the FAL. How is accuracy at 200 metres?

[LittleLebowski]

I'd love to try the FAL. How is accuracy at 200 metres?

About 4-ish inch groups. I think about 10 cm? It's not the most accurate rifle but it's not inaccurate either if that makes sense. I like it a lot. It's never malfunctioned. The 1-4x Trijicon scope works well on it.

[Rossmeister]

I'd love to try it and compare it to the G3, which was my service weapon back in 07/08.

[LittleLebowski]

I've shot both and they are both available to civilians here in the US. The G3 is more accurate but recoils much harder and mangles the spent brass with its fluted chamber thereby rendering it no good for reloading. If one wants a truly accurate .308/7.62 gas operated rifle, the ARs are ruling the battlefield in the form of the LMT MWS (adopted by the British) and the Knights Armament rifles (US Marine and US Army issue sniper rifles).

As it is, I traded a Glock 26 and $200 cash for this FAL, 27 magazines, and 1k rds of ammo. I am very pleased with it.

[Mako72]

Sure is pretty!! Both of them. I still want one of the DSA SA58 Para Congos one of these days, hhmmm... Maybe tax return this next year... If I can get it past the wife....


Jay

[camjr]

That Malinois probably ejects spent 7.62 NATO as well...

I've got a German Shepherd/Malinois mix named Fritz. Fantastic puppy dog. Smaller build and shorter coat of the Malinois, but the markings of a GSD. Great family dog and very vigilant of all the neighborhood goings-on.

[JayM]

Another great .308 recommendation is the Springfield Armory M1A (civilian model of the M14)

200 yd groups open sights are 4 inch standing with locked in sling. (standard Military sling) - put it on the bench and you can tighten this up some, but ammo starts to come into play.
Put a scope on it and you can easily walk this rifle out to 800 + yards with out any issues and still hold 4 - 6" groups - ammo dependent.
Best groups shot by myself are bench rested, and sand bagged 200 yards scoped, with home made rounds = .75 inches center to center.

Expect to spend nearly $1500 for one... I got mine off a guy going thru a divorce - so I did not spend anywhere near that much.

John you got a decent rife for the $600 - $700 range... (assuming a glock 26 is $400 - $500)

And Nacho - well he is a fantastic looking pup, and he looks well cared for - I think you are set to fend off any home invasions...

[miamimoe]

Great choices, both. The Israel Defense Forces (IDF) Oketz unit, has gone strictly with Belgian Malinois for security/defense. They do have some labs for bomb detection and rescue work (think Earthquakes, building collapse), but for security field work, only the Belgians.

[Rossmeister]

I've shot both and they are both available to civilians here in the US. The G3 is more accurate but recoils much harder and mangles the spent brass with its fluted chamber thereby rendering it no good for reloading.

The G3 has a much shorter barrel though, why is the FAL less accurate?

[LittleLebowski]

The G3 has a much shorter barrel though, why is the FAL less accurate?

The locking system of the bolt to the barrel.

Also....shorter barrels does not mean worse accuracy. This is being proven in the tactical long range shooting community with 20" and below barrels doing quite well. You lose about 50 fps (feet per second) per inch of barrel removed. It's up to you to do the math on your velocity and how much velocity you need to get to a certain distance.

[LittleLebowski]

Also, the FAL came to me in a trade that I could not turn down. Were I in the market for a .308 "battle rifle," I would run not walk, to the Larue PredaTAR.

[Rossmeister]

So would you say that the main practical ballistic difference is a flatter trajectory with the FAL?

[LittleLebowski]

So would you say that the main practical ballistic difference is a flatter trajectory with the FAL?

Definitely not. Same caliber.

[Rossmeister]

Wouldn't the increased velocity create a flatter trajectory? I'm no ballistics expert..

[LittleLebowski]

Wouldn't the increased velocity create a flatter trajectory? I'm no ballistics expert..

Ah, I see where you're going now, my apologies. Yes, slightly but given that the two weapons are chambered in the same caliber, the edge will go to the more accurate weapon.

[Dr Roadrash]

Beautiful dog, I bet no one is stealing anthing from you. Seems to be some easier targets around

[LittleLebowski]

Not bad for a Craigslist adoption. Poor guy needed a home and I scooped him up right after my German Shepherd passed away. He is making for an excellent family dog. Very toddler friendly.

[Rossmeister]

Ah, I see where you're going now, my apologies. Yes, slightly but given that the two weapons are chambered in the same caliber, the edge will go to the more accurate weapon.

Yeah. I like the G3 (AG3 variant is what I've used). The FAL effective range is listed as higher than the G3's though.

[LittleLebowski]

Part of the team on security detail.

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h251/baxshep/IMAG0533.jpg

[Wildalaska]

As much as I admire FALs, I would rather have an M1A

[LittleLebowski]

As much as I admire FALs, I would rather have an M1A

I'm not keen on the optics mounting, high cheek weld if you're using an optic, the shoddy Springfield parts that need to be replaced with USGI parts, nor the safety in the trigger guard. However, I do respect its slightly better accuracy (better than the FAL) and handiness in its traditional styled fiber glass stock with irons or a red dot sight. Both weapons have been completely obsoleted by the amazing new crop of 7.62 ARs; a few of which are in combat right now. The LaRue PredaTAR, LMT MWS, Knights SR25, and Knights SR25 EMC all outshoot the M14 and FAL handily and are showing very good reliability as data rolls in from the battlefields ours and the British military are deployed to. Not mention the modularity of the AR design and far far superior optics mounting choices.

I do believe the FAL to be one of the most reliable 7.62 battle rifles out there. I'll never get rid of mine and would never feel outgunned with it in hand.