Gillette connoisseurs: Is this a French 1907-1908 Old Type Standard Set?

[wimbouman]

Hello,

Last week I went a bit bananas on the French eBay site and bought some razors.
This is one of them.

From Mr-Razor (http://www.mr-razor.com/Rasierer/Old%20Type/Old%20Type.htm) I understand it is a standard set Open Type from around 1907-1908.

I am not familiar with Open Type Gillettes, so please educate me!
(I also bought another, will post pics in another thread to avoid confusion).

This one seems to be French, as the case says 'Company Gillette' and not 'Gillette Company', and there's a couple of French blades in it also.

I guess I did fine for nearly 7 euros :001_smile

Does anyone have more info on this particular razor?
Did I date and identify correctly?

[MacDaddy]

Yup, this is definitely a Gillette Single Ring, and the case is a 1906-1908 Standard Set case with the script logo that was used before the diamond logo. The cardboard box of blades is much more modern; the set would have originally had two blade cases. The script logo Standard Sets that I have all came with the older cardboard blade sleeves, but the metal blade case you've got there could be proper for the set, and I would think would make a later date in that range towards 1908 more likely (assuming it is correct).

There should be a serial number on the inner barrel or the guard plate of the razor. I would expect the barrel to be more likely if the razor is original to the case. I can see it has the "G" inside "D" stamp under the head. (No one's quite sure what that represents, as far as I know. Just anecdotal evidence, but I've noticed that I seem to see it more frequently on razors that came out of the European market.)

One thing I find odd, though, is that I can't see any indication of a patent date or any kind of stamping on the outer handle at all in any of your pictures. I would expect some sort of stamping in that time frame.

[wimbouman]

Thx, MacDaddy.

Yeah, there is no stamping.
That is possible, though, I checked at Mr-Razor.

I've seen the two blade cases at that site also, too bad this one has only got one (left).

I think (read it at the auction text, but I am no good at French at all) that this one is European, to be more precise French.

[MacDaddy]

There's not even a serial number stamped? Are you sure of that?

[wimbouman]

Yes, I am sure. 99%.
Not at the handle, not at the head, not at the bottom part.

Will have a look tomorrow to make sure (it's night here now) but I think there are no marks.

Any idea what that could indicate?

[KM-instructor]

What a beauty too, Seeing this one has spurred me on to dig out some of my older stuff, as you kinda forget how beautiful they are until you see pictures listed.

Thanks for listing this, now excuse me i must go wipe up the drool from my keyboard.

[nemo]

There's not even a serial number stamped? Are you sure of that?

According to B&B wiki "From Oct 18 1927 to Aug 27 1928, there were no serial numbers used"

I have one, no serial number, but for the American market

[MacDaddy]

Any idea what that could indicate?

Well, the lack of a serial number and a patent date stamp would be normal for a post Nov 1921 Old Type, since the patents had expired and the Old Types were no longer being numbered. But in that case I would expect the diamond logo and a "Made in.." stamp on the underside of the guard plate. It's entirely common for the older Old Types to not have the logo or a "Made in..." designation, but I've never personally seen one without a serial number or patent date in some form -- with the exception of the extremely old Double Rings.

One other possibility is that someone combined parts of different razors with problems to make a single good razor.

I'm certainly willing to be wrong on any of that, if someone has better info.

[MacDaddy]

According to B&B wiki "From Oct 18 1927 to Aug 27 1928, there were no serial numbers used"

Those are New Improveds, not Old Types.

[nemo]

Those are New Improveds, not Old Types.

I think both since the Old Type was made until 1929? Are you positive about that?

[midniterambler]

none of the old types after 8/1921 had serial numbers; the handles (in the us, at least) were the composite handles like the pocket edition razor handles. i'm puzzled as to why the comb guard doesn't have the gillette logo and "made in ..." on it.

[MacDaddy]

I think both since the Old Type was made until 1929? Are you positive about that?

Yup, positive. They stopped numbering Old Types when the patents expired and shifted the numbering over to the New Improved line when it came out.

There were some post-patent Single-Ring-style Old Types sold as they used up existing stock, so they weren't all just the Pocket-Edition-style razors, but I don't think I've ever seen one of those that was silver plated. They certainly could exist, but I'm pretty sure I've only ever seen them in gold.

[TheRazorSleepsForNoOne]

The metal blade box is from around 1906 to 1912 as the 'GILLETTE BLADES' on the cap is the smaller, slimmer font. I noticed this with the many ABC pocket sets. Later metal blade boxes had 'GILLETTE BLADES' in a bigger, taller font which was then eventually replaced with the Gillette diamond logo.

I also notice the repair stamp on the razor, the G inside of D.

[MacDaddy]

I also notice the repair stamp on the razor, the G inside of D.

I've seen other places online where people claim the "G inside D" is a repair mark, but I've never seen anyone with actual information backing that up. Seems that they're all just repeating something they've heard on other forums. I'd be interested if you've got an authoritative source on that.

[alex2363]

from 1904 to 1929 most razors had serial numbers,from mid 1921 on only the New improved Or New Standard model pat/1920, had serial numbers. any original model made after 1920 were not numbered. serial numbers were stoped 1921 and started in 1951. as letter/number codes until 1980 or later.

[gearchow]

from 1904 to 1929 most razors had serial numbers,from mid 1921 on only the New improved Or New Standard model pat/1920, had serial numbers. any original model made after 1920 were not numbered. serial numbers were stoped 1921 and started in 1951. as letter/number codes until 1980 or later.

Serial numbers for the NEW De Lux are in there as well - 1928 or 1929? can't recall off hand.

-jim

[gearchow]

FYI:

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php/170187-Acquisitions-for-October-2010?p=2463287#post2463287

-jim