Need help identifying this thin bar handle NEW

[IronHammer]

I need some help identifying what this beast is, exactly. I know it looks rough, but it came in a lot I picked up and I was thoroughly intrigued by the knurling on this handle. The razor on the left is a "normal" thin bar handle NEW. The one on the right is just odd. The head has the diamond mark but no patent information which leads me to think it's 1929 or 1930. Any ideas?

http://rtccom.net/~sledge/Razors/Thin%20Bar%20Handle%20NEW%20Variant/Images/1.jpg

http://rtccom.net/~sledge/Razors/Thin%20Bar%20Handle%20NEW%20Variant/Images/4.jpg

[surpera1]

short comb NEW and long comb NEW
long comb appears to have a big boy handle

[IronHammer]

short comb NEW and long comb NEW
long comb appears to have a big boy handle

Yeah, I just noticed the "normal" NEW has short combs and the odd one has long combs. Now I am even more confused.

[IronHammer]

I'm not sure what you mean by 'big boy' handle but I also notice that the handle on the odd one is several millimeters thinner than the 'normal' one.

[amishmotorboat]

Otto Roth

http://www.mr-razor.com/Rasierer/The%20NEW/1930s%20NEW%20Gillette-Rotbart%20Hybrid.jpg

[IronHammer]

Aha. Otto Roth. That thought had occurred to me but I was thrown off by the Gillette long-comb head on it. Either this is handle and head was mismatched purposely by a later owner or Gillette used some of Roth's handles after the "merger" to put make their Thin Handle NEW razors.

[MacDaddy]

Looks more or less like the thin-handled version of the Red & Black handle knurling with the smooth band below the neck.

[IronHammer]

Looks more or less like the thin-handled version of the Red & Black handle knurling with the smooth band below the neck.

Yes, I have the thicker Bar Handle NEW Otto Roth razor with the smooth band. So this is cool. I now have two Otto Roth's of both types. This one is quite ugly though :biggrin1:

[IronHammer]

Here is the nickel version of an Otto Roth bar handle long comb NEW.

http://rtccom.net/~sledge/Razors/Nickel%20NEW/Images/13.jpg

[MacDaddy]

Looks like Xillion's got a nickle version of this same razor (http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showpost.php?p=3105334&postcount=3). Can't quite tell from the angle of the photo, but it looks like it's got just the logo and "Made in USA" like yours.

[IronHammer]

Looks like Xillion's got a nickle version of this same razor (http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showpost.php?p=3105334&postcount=3). Can't quite tell from the angle of the photo, but it looks like it's got just the logo and "Made in USA" like yours.

Indeed! That's a darn fine looking razor, too! If I didn't know better, I would say it was a replate.

[MacDaddy]

BTW, I believe the Rotbart acquisition happened before the NEWs were released. So the ones released with the "Otto Roth" name would really have still been Gillettes, just like the Rotbart designs that were released under the Gillette name. That is, in all likelihood these razors were being produced under both names at the same time until the point where Gillette subsumed the Otto Roth brand entirely.

And the fact that the thin handles would have the same variations as the thick ones it perfectly logical, too. I just picked up a nickel thin-handled short comb myself in a larger lot recently, but it's the style with the knurling all the way to the neck, just like your other one in the first photo.

[IronHammer]

BTW, I believe the Rotbart acquisition happened before the NEWs were released. So the ones released with the "Otto Roth" name would really have still been Gillettes, just like the Rotbart designs that were released under the Gillette name. That is, in all likelihood these razors were being produced under both names at the same time until the point where Gillette subsumed the Otto Roth brand entirely.

Good point! I just never understood how a Gillette head could have been stamped with 'Otto Roth, Inc' instead of the diamond mark. That just doesn't compute.

[MacDaddy]

Good point! I just never understood how a Gillette head could have been stamped with 'Otto Roth, Inc' instead of the diamond mark. That just doesn't compute.

Then this one of bensherman's (http://badgerandblade.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=14930) is just going to cause you to seg fault.

http://badgerandblade.com/gallery/displayimage.php?imageid=14930

[IronHammer]

Then this one of bensherman's (http://badgerandblade.com/gallery/showimage.php?i=14930) is just going to cause you to seg fault.



Whoa! Very cool. So, apparently, Otto Roth's Gillette clones were so perfect that Gillette decided to use their parts. That explains why we see Otto Roth heads with Gillette patent numbers on them. And of course, bensherman's very unique and cool head with both marks on them. Thanks for that link, MacDaddy!

[MacDaddy]

Whoa! Very cool. So, apparently, Otto Roth's Gillette clones were so perfect that Gillette decided to use their parts. That explains why we see Otto Roth heads with Gillette patent numbers on them.

No, that's what I was saying before; I don't think they were "clones" in the real sense. I think they were producing Gillette designs under Gillette's direction but still operating as a separate brand during a transitional period to ease the market over to the Gillette name.

[IronHammer]

No, that's what I was saying before; I don't think they were "clones" in the real sense. I think they were producing Gillette designs under Gillette's direction but still operating as a separate brand during a transitional period to ease the market over to the Gillette name.

I mis-remember Krumholz apparently. I need to go back and read again. Thanks for the correction on that.