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View Full Version : First DE Shave - not what I was expecting



ralph86
05-25-2011, 09:27 AM
Hello all,

So, I recently acquired a brand new Merkur Hefty Classic, badger brush, blade sampler back, shaving soap, as well as other assorted odds and ends, and I finally worked up the guts to give it a whirl. I think I was either expecting the best shave of my life or a complete, unmitigated disaster. But here I am, three days after my shave, and my razor burn looks about the same as usual - that is to say, not horrendous...but pretty bad.

I recently took to growing a beard again, which is not particularly helpful in that my neck is my biggest problem area when it comes to razor burn, but it is good I suppose in that it allows me to practice shaving on a smaller area while I get used to using the new razor.

In any case, I'm going to describe what I did during my shave, and then I have a few burning questions (pardon the pun) which hopefully I can get cleared up soon (was that another pun?)

The Shave

-First of all, love the razor. Love the feel of it. Love the look of it. Love the badger brush. Love the smell of the soap. Love creating the lather. Love the feel of the lathered brush on my face. There really is something so appealing and comforting about these products and this process, and I'm really hoping that one day I'll figure things out...

-Anyway I had a brief hot shower. Boiled some water and poured it into the bathroom sink; then poured in some cold and some hot water to dilute the water in the sink so that it wasn't scalding hot. Put the brush into the sink and let it soak. Created some lather in a decent sized cereal bowl. Swirled the lather onto my neck with the brush. Got a washcloth, soaked it in hot water, and put it over top of the lather on my neck. Repeated this a few times for a minute or so. Splashed some more hot water on my face.

-Re-lathered my neck. I think my lather was decent - at least it looked okay to me. Not too frothy and not too bubbly. For all I know it could have been complete shit, but I have a feeling that my problems lie elsewhere (which I will get to soon).

-Grabbed the razor. I used a Derby blade. Started out at the edges of my neck, where the hair isn't too thick. This seemed to go well - the hair seemed to slide off my neck relatively easily. I tried to use as little pressure as possible, but I'm sure I still used a bit too much. Then I moved on to the middle of my neck and shaved the remainder of the hair on my neck. Here I'm positive I used too much pressure. I know that I still have bad habits from my time using a cartridge razor, and I kind of forgot about the whole reduction-not-elimination thing. I think I have a tendency to shave a bit too fast, too. Anyway, after one N-S pass, my neck was finished. I hadn't shaved in a week, so the hair had been at a decent length prior to the shave. There was only one tiny cut on my neck and a few stray hairs, which I used tweezers to remove.

-After this I splashed cold water on myself, rubbed an alum block on my neck. Rinsed that off and applied some of the new bump patrol aftershave (which I also bought recently and which certainly didn't seem to help...I had tons of bumps this week). Patted my face dry and I was done.

Anyway...

The Questions

1) Like I said, I decided to do only one N-S pass on my neck. I will admit that the whole concept of grain direction does leave me a little bit bewildered. I understand in general how to determine which direction the hair grows on my neck, but my problem is that it seems like by and large, my neck is a complete mess of hairs going all over the place. So I figured that rather than exhaust myself mentally on my first shave trying to shave in a dozen different directions, I'd just keep it simple while I'm getting used to the razor. Also, I have watched several different videos on youtube of men wet shaving (including one by mantic) and in each of these videos, the gent in question just seems to shave N-S on his neck for the first pass. This confuses me because there is so much stress on this website about the necessity of shaving WTG on the first pass. But I thought I'd give it a shot, just for starters. In any case, I'm still a bit confused in regards to grain direction - my hair does seem to grow in a general direction at a few different points on my neck. When it comes to shaving WTG, am I to take that to mean shaving in the direction that MOST hairs in a given part of my face grow? Because on numerous parts of my face there are a few hairs here and there just completely doing their own thing, marching to the beat of their own annoying little drums. If I truly went out of my way to shave WTG in every possible place, I honestly feel like I'd be shaving in five different directions on my neck alone. Add an XTG and an ATG pass and this means that I'd be shaving in 15 different directions(!), doesn't it? Maybe I'm over complicating the issue, but some clarification here would be much appreciated.

2) Okay, razor burn. It's driving me nuts and frustrating me more and more with each passing week. That I get. Here's what I don't get. On numerous websites I have read something like, "if you shave and you get razor burn, wait a day or two before you shave again." Well that's all well and good, but when I get razor burn, it lasts for at least a week, usually closer to two. Usually it takes about two days to appear, at which point it gets gradually worse for three or four days. About a week/a week and a half after I shave, I still have significant redness/irritation/razor bumps/scabbing - not horrifically severe or anything, but significant. So how does this work in regards to when/how often I should shave? I don't want to shave over top of existing razor burn, because I imagine that this will potentially aggravate what's already there...but is one-and-a-half/two weeks worth of hair growth an appropriate amount to shave with a DE razor? How much hair is too much hair? What is the ideal thing for me to do in this situation?

3) I will admit that I have a tendency to pick at razor bumps - they are rather unsightly, after all. But I feel like even when I just ignore the razor burn and don't touch my neck, it takes a really long time to go away. Is it even normal that I have razor burn for so long after every shave? Am I missing something here? And in regards to razor bumps, what is the appropriate method of dealing with them, if I'm not supposed to pick at them?

4) Finally, I used a Derby, and I know that the general consensus here seems to be that beginners should try not to constantly change parts of their shaving regimen during the learning stage, but should I perhaps switch to a sharper blade right off the bat? I have Sharks and Astras as well. I know that it may be a bit hasty, but I was wondering if it makes sense because a) I have a very thick, coarse, and curly beard, and b) based on the aforementioned points I made about my razor burn, it seems like maybe it would be ideal for me to wait a week or so between shaves, meaning that the hair will be at a pretty decent length.

Anyway this post is becoming increasingly long-winded and convoluted, and I think that my frustration is beginning to seep through, so I'm gonna peace out. Everyone here has been incredibly helpful and friendly so far, so I just want to say thanks for all of your help, past, present, and future. In any case, some insight into any or all of my quandaries would be greatly, greatly appreciated.

All the best,

-Ralph

DaveNJ74
05-25-2011, 10:08 AM
I was and sometimes in the same boat as you. For years I shaved with everything and anything and always had razor burn. When switching to DE it was brutal at first then started having good shaves.
I then tried shaving with a mach3 using the same prep, products and techniques I learned from this forum and had better shaves even with the gimmick razors out there but I still get bumps and little pimples here and there. I also search the internet for ways to deal with it. Good luck, you came to the right place and welcome.

gaj90027
05-25-2011, 10:17 AM
Congrats on making the switch to DE shaving and you did the right thing posting here. I'm sure you will get many suggestions and something is bound to work for your face.

Here is my 2 cents:

1 - Going WTG is pretty important for your first pass as you know we are trying for reduction and WTG is the path of least resistance and should cause the least amount of irritation. I think you should be okay if you figure out in general which direction most of the hair is growing and use that direction as your WTG pass. For me I can only shave my neck WTG on all 3 passes and for me this means 3 S to N passes. My hair is kind of a mess on my neck as well but the majority grow in this direction and the S to N passes work great for me.

2 - If you still have redness and irritation for a week after shaving I have a feeling something else is going on with your skin. Sounds like an allergic reaction or a medical condition. Best advice would be to see a doctor. If this is not a viable option for you I would look into starting some kind of skin care plan. Do you use any kind of face soap, moisturizer or toner? How about after the shave, do you use an aftershave splash or balm? Do you have a problem with acne or overly dry sensitive skin?

3 - Don't pick the razor bumps, this will lead to infection and prolong the problem. Better technique and a good aftershave product will go a long way to preventing the bumps.

4 - Derby's are a well known blade but they might not be the right blade for you. I'm glad you got a blade sampler. Try shaving at least a week with each brand of blade unless the results are truly horrific and painful then move on to the next blade and the next blade, etc. If none of the blades feel right you may have to switch your cream or soap (what exactly do you have) and start with the blade experiments again. If that doesn't help you may be experiencing badger burn and might need a synthetic or boar brush.

Stick with it, post specific details, photos are great also and the gents here will be glad to advise you along the way.

I'll say it again though with regards to your prolonged irritation - if it's really that bad I would see a doctor.

franz
05-25-2011, 10:36 AM
Hello all,

So, I recently acquired a brand new Merkur Hefty Classic, badger brush, blade sampler back, shaving soap, as well as other assorted odds and ends.....

-Ralph

Hey Ralph,

There's a lot in your post but I will try to give you a couple quick answers/tips.

1) It'd be fair to say that you can't individually slice each and every hair WTG especially if they grow in goofy directions. Your best bet is to follow the overall grain of your beard as much as possible.

2) That's more than just razor burn. Razor burn is just surface irritation from beating up your skin. What you're describing sounds more like razor bumps / folliculitis.

3) For ingrowns: if you can see the hair and it is close to the surface, you can gently tweeze it out. Otherwise, you can apply a warm wet washcloth a couple of times a day, keep the area clean to ward off bacteria, and scrub gently with an old toothbrush or something similar to help release the hair.

4) You can try a sharper blade next time, your blade choice isn't set in stone. The advice against switching blades is more about being able to isolate variables than it is about blade monogamy. You have bigger fish to fry right now anyway.

I would try either a shower prep or a towel+lather (http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=9745) prep, not both. Whichever one you choose, it takes a few minutes to soften whiskers so do it thoroughly. It doesn't need to be scalding hot, by the way. Tepid is fine. Some of the CWS gurus use cold all the way.

Lastly, you may want to cleanse your skin/beard prior to the shave to slough off excess bacteria. I think there's a problem brewing there.

YetiDave
05-25-2011, 11:17 AM
I'll recommend what I always recommend - cut out the hot water :thumbup1:

Eric V
05-25-2011, 01:00 PM
Lots of good advice above!

As mentioned, your razor burn doesn't sound like razor burn to me. It sounds like a possible allergy. Witch Hazel after your shave may help clear this up.

As mentioned, do less prep. And use less hot water.

Go ahead and change blades. Besides developing lather skills, finding the blade that works easiest for you at this stage is perhaps the most important thing in building your skill.

Let us know how things are going with your progress as often as you wish. We are interested, and many of us have faced similar issues.

Dan M
05-25-2011, 01:18 PM
I will say this, I am new to DE shaving myself (only about 6 shaves), I have a tendency to get razor bumps on my neck, especially on ,y right side, and it is even worse it I go XTG and ATG.

So I decided to go to a 2 pass N-S (WTG or so I thought) shave.

I grew out my beard for about 3 days (I do not have an aggressive growth. I had my wife come in and inspect the growth and tell me what direction is was growing.

Just under my jawline my hair grows NW to SE diagonally, and at the first crease (my biggest problem area due East toward the ear, and below the first crease it grow diagonally upward SW to NE.

So basically my neck grows diagonally toward each other meets in the middle and heads for the ear.

So I adjusted my first pass to attempt to go with the grain, and saw a drastic improvement in bump reduction.

After all that my advice is, LEARN and KNOW thy face!

Dan

Vic2009
05-25-2011, 01:32 PM
Hi Ralph,

I'm new, too, only shaved 6 or 7 times with a DE razor.

When I run my fingertip on my facial hairs, I can actually feel which direction they grow.

For my last 2 shaves, I tried applying some oil on my wet face after the shower, (L'Occitane Rose massage oil -- I know, it's not a shaving product!) before preparing and applying the lather. The shave was MUCH smoother.

Go S L O W. I shave at night when it's not rushed. If you feel rushed, better to put it off.

Jim Raynor
05-25-2011, 01:36 PM
For now, try WTG passes only, 2 should reduce your stubble to an acceptable level. Being a newbie myself I noticed the lather consistency and blade choice are pretty important. Derby cut me up pretty rough but my last 3 shaves with a Shark were much better. Don't be afraid to remake a nice lather if you think it's insufficient to shave with, take your time. You'll notice when one lather is better than another, it feels creamy and very slick, you also feel the razor gliding better over your skin. Also, when doing your pass and you're going to one of the problem areas, take your brush and apply some more lather to keep it nice and moist, especially if you're taking your time. Your burn could be from an allergy, as someone suggested. By the way, lots of great advice above. Don't get discouraged, and try to enjoy the process, your face will reward you with great results. Try to read alot and watch alot of tutorials on youtube, good luck!

demaro
05-25-2011, 04:07 PM
Welcome to the group !! Sounds like you may be using too much pressure. Use zero pressure with razor. Let the weight of the razor do the work. Also look up Mantic59 videos on you tube on shaving.

GDCarrington
05-25-2011, 05:50 PM
Welcome aboard the good ship B&B. Take a stroll on the promenade deck and enjoy the voyage. :thumbup1:

Be sure you take a look at the following thread. It has a lot of helpful information.

WET SHAVING INSTRUCTIONS AND TUTORIALS: New? READ THIS THREAD!

http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=71700

Always remember, relax but be vigilant when you shave!

DaveNJ74
05-25-2011, 08:02 PM
What did everyone do back in the days when DE shaving was the norm and not a hobby? Did anyone get razor burn and irritations?

Kentos
05-25-2011, 08:22 PM
What did everyone do back in the days when DE shaving was the norm and not a hobby? Did anyone get razor burn and irritations?

I'm guessing a lot more beards being worn.

bokaba
05-25-2011, 08:34 PM
If possible, I'd suggest not shaving for a day or two and giving it another try. Check out the wiki article on blade angle--this was very helpful for me after to returning to DEs after about a 1 year hiatus. Also use very little pressure--less is more here. You may not notice results after one pass, but after several light passes, the magic will begin to happen. Also, make sure your prep is good.

KM-instructor
05-26-2011, 12:46 AM
Welcome to the group !! Sounds like you may be using too much pressure. Use zero pressure with razor. Let the weight of the razor do the work. Also look up Mantic59 videos on you tube on shaving.
Yeppers sounds about right.

ackvil
05-26-2011, 04:33 AM
Welcome to B&B.

Some good advice above. I won't repeat it but will add my two cents.

For me, the most sensitive area is my neck. Like you, I have hairs growing in every direction on my neck and very sensitive skin there.

Preparation, lather, no pressure and blade angle are vital to a good, irritation free shave. DE shaving is different from cartridge shaving in that you must be sure you are not putting any pressure on the blade. Let the weight of the razor do the work for you. To assure this I use two fingers and my thumb to hold the razor with another finger resting on the tip of the handle. This results in holding the razor very lightly with no pressure on the razor. You want to hold the razor as lightly as you can without it falling from your hand. And here (http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread.php?t=130110) is a good post that will help you on blade angle.

I use Uberlather: http://wiki.badgerandblade.com/index.php?title=Uberlather
by combining soap and cream with a few drops of glycerin to the lather to assure a smooth, irritation-free shave. Since using uberlather, I have consistently gotten better shaves with no irritation. However, even with this lather NO PRESSURE and blade angle are vital.

What you do after you shave also is important.

First, I take any remaining uberlather cream from my shaving mug and gently massage it onto my face and neck. The lather which contains glycerin is very soothing. I then rinse my face with warm water to take off the cream. Next, I soak a wash cloth in cold water and put in on my face for about 30 seconds. Next I apply a splash of Thayers Rose Petal or Lavender WH. Both are alcohol free and do not sting when going on but provide soothing relief to my skin. I then use a skin moisturizer or ASB to provide relief. There are a number of good products out there such as Nivea, Neutrogena, T&H, GFT, and others. Another good one that is not meant only for shaving but does an excellent job is CeraVe Facial Moisturizing Lotion. Also, at night I put on a moisturizer – usually CeraVe – and that hastens the healing process and prepares my face for the next day’s shave.

Hope this helps.

Snargle
05-26-2011, 04:50 AM
What did everyone do back in the days when DE shaving was the norm and not a hobby? Did anyone get razor burn and irritations?

As I recall, there were a lot of guys walking around with little pieces of toilet paper stuck to their messed-up faces. I for one, am glad I don't shave like my grandpa did...the tools, products, and information we have available to us now means that conscientious wet-shavers are getting high-quality, comfortable shaves and even having fun in the process! :thumbup:

Sledgehammer39
05-26-2011, 07:31 AM
Welcome Aboard.. Lot's of good advice given above.. :thumbup:

boboshave
05-26-2011, 09:56 AM
Hi, Welcome. Just relax. WAAAY too much prep.

The best tip I ever got was:
Just wet your face, lather up, and go make tea or coffee. This should take less than 5 minutes. While the coffee brews or tea steaps, for about 3 minutes, come back to the bathroom and shave it all off and put on your shirt. Enjoy the coffee.

The waiting and wearing of the lather really does soften the beard a little bit. If the lather is a little dry, I put on a little more right before the balde goes on.


Go really gently with the razor, and go with the grain for at least a couple months; you're in training, not yet in competition. Remember, you're just going to school or work: you don't need to be prepped for serious necking at all times; you just need to look groomed and clean.

The tip about witch hazel is a good one. I put mine in a small squeeze bottle from some liquid soap so it can live on the counter for instant and easy access. I would skip any fragrance or alcohol based aftershave for a couple months. You probabaly don't need to dry out your skin with that stuff.

jwcarlson
05-26-2011, 10:09 AM
There's 1,000,000 different ideas, here's what I do.

This happens the same with or without a shower before...
Wet face with cold water and let the water run on the brush while I do this.
Squeeze out the water from the brush and load the brush.
Re-wet face and face lather, adding water as needed.
LET THE LATHER SIT FOR ABOUT ONE-TWO MINUTES!
Walk around, brush your teeth, blow your nose... whatever.
Come back and rewet everything with your brush and work the lather a bit more.
Shave and then relather and shave as needed. Don't be afraid to add more water during the pass and rewet everything.
I use cold water for every step of the way and my skin feels so much better than when I was using very hot water.

For aftershave I use witch hazel or witch hazel with 1-2 drops of glycerin mixed in if I feel like I got a little irriation.

GregDR
05-26-2011, 10:25 AM
Sometimes it's as simple as making sure you rinse all the soap off. Splash extra water on your neck the next time you shave. Maybe about 10 times then take a clean damp rag and gently touch it on your neck then a couple more splashs of water. Then if you want follow that up with Witch Hazel then your favorite AS.

Go West Young Man
05-26-2011, 11:19 AM
You can't complain after ONE shave about the bad results - learning to DE shave is a MONTHS LONG process.

Study the tutorials and videos, experiment to find out what advice works for your specific face and what doesn't, focus on getting the fundamentals right and don't get all tied up in complex routines. Focus on doing a little better each day, try to to do one thing every day that improves your shave.

Be patient. It's going to take some time, but once you figure it out you'll never go back. Or maybe you will, some guys value simplicity and speed, other prefer the slower but more satisfying route. Feel free to pick and chose what works for you and ignore what doesn't add to your satisfaction.

ralph86
05-29-2011, 05:41 AM
Hi Everyone,

Just wanted to say thanks a million for all of the replies. Everyone here is so thoughtful and helfpul. I'll definitely take everything into consideration and will persist. I'm sure I'll be back with more questions/updates eventually.

Cheers,

-Ralph

mlp2147
05-29-2011, 06:33 AM
Welcome aboard and stick with it!