Top Shot

[americanarmsdealer]

Has anyone else been watching this show on the History Channel? It's pretty cool. Kind of like a Survivor with guns and without the irritating drama. You ought to check it out. I think the next new episode is on Sunday night.

[betat]

Caught the show the other night where the collector was firing early American flintlocks at "the broad side of a barn" i.e. a large wooden target. The inaccuracy of the non-rifled barrel was so profound it made you wonder how anyone not in a volley line could be effective with one. It also makes me question the historical accuracy of "Last of the Mohicans" where Daniel Day-Lewis is picking off the guys in the forrest, at night, while the messengers are trying to run from the fort.

[DougK]

If I'm not mistaken, both rifled and smoothbore weapons would have been available during the era of "Last of the Mohicans", although rifles would only have been used by skirmishers and not general infantry troops. The smoothbore musket would have been the standard infantry weapon and yes, the inaccuracy is exactly why armies lined up shoulder to shoulder and blasted away at each other from one hundred yards or so.

[knlgskr]

Wonder why the Ferguson rifle never became popular; thought it had advantages over muzzle loaders.

[The Nid Hog]

Caught the show the other night where the collector was firing early American flintlocks at "the broad side of a barn" i.e. a large wooden target. The inaccuracy of the non-rifled barrel was so profound it made you wonder how anyone not in a volley line could be effective with one. It also makes me question the historical accuracy of "Last of the Mohicans" where Daniel Day-Lewis is picking off the guys in the forrest, at night, while the messengers are trying to run from the fort.

Smoothbore muskets suffered from the accuracy problems that you describe. However, the Deerslayer/Natty Bumppo/Hawkeye carried a long rifle (named, in the novels, "Killdeer"--I can't remember if it's called that in the movie or not). They were significantly more accurate. A quick glance at Wikipedia (not the most reliable source) says that Daniel Boone, using a similar rifle, was credited with killing a British officer at the Seige of Boonesborough with a head shot at 250m.

[Amer]

Watched the first episode, not sure if any more are out there. If so my DVR should have picked them up.

I don't understand the elimination. The guy on that red team missed that target like, 30 times, yet somehow he finagled a tie against the other guy because he wanted to "face the best." WTF? I can understand wanting to keep him around if you think he's better in other events, but the young guy that he faced off against didn't even get a chance to participate in the challenge and he was having people try to vote them off. The sniping challenge at the end only confirmed his ineptitude. I understand the politics and such of these shows but I can't see how any of them could have voted for the young guy when they didn't even get to see him shoot. He definitely schooled them all at the end.

[dartmn9]

There is some amazing shooting on that show.

[mr_economy]

Great first episode; we have our DVR set to record the whole season. I enjoyed seeing the young kid shoot lights out in the elimination round. It'll be interesting to see how the battle experience of the marines and other military/police types compares with the technical expertise of the competition rifle shooters.

[americanarmsdealer]

and other military/police types compares with the technical expertise of the competition rifle shooters.
I think we've already seen a bit of that. Kelly is a competitive rifle shooter, and the guy that got eliminated was an ex-Marine, wasn't he? I've always thought that every Marine was a rifleman, but apparantly that statement doesn't hold true across the board.:001_rolle

[Bertilak]

Two things I thought interesting, relating to the Mythbusters show:


They showed a guy split one arrow with another and I think that was one of the BUSTED myths from Mythbusters show.
They claimed it was impossible to light a match with a bullet but that was one of the CONFIRMED myths on the Mythhbusters show.


UPDATE: I am confusing this show with another!

[Commander Quan]

I got through all but the last 20 minutes this morning before I had to leave for work, but I'll finish watching it tonight.

I don't like the competition shows where the competitors are voted off, or into elimination by their teammates. I would rather see the competitors with the least amount of skill or the ones that choke leave, rather than the ones that can't make friends.

Whoever the guy was that voted for Kelly to go to elimination because Mike wanted to go against the best literally was shooting his team in the foot. If you think the kid is the best and could help your team win why would you risk putting him out.

[Bertilak]

I got through all but the last 20 minutes this morning before I had to leave for work, but I'll finish watching it tonight.

I don't like the competition shows where the competitors are voted off, or into elimination by their teammates. I would rather see the competitors with the least amount of skill or the ones that choke leave, rather than the ones that can't make friends.

Whoever the guy was that voted for Kelly to go to elimination because Mike wanted to go against the best literally was shooting his team in the foot. If you think the kid is the best and could help your team win why would you risk putting him out.

I mostly agree. One guy did have a point about the guy who volunteered to go -- anyone can have a bad day (e.g. Mike, maybe) but someone whose heart wasn't into it -- or perhaps had his priorities a bit twisted up -- might have been a better one to go. You might say it was a form of "choking" that just hadn't shown up in actual competition yet.

[Commander Quan]

Brad was the guy that volunteered to go, and if I were the other guys on the team I would have taken him up on the offer.

[americanarmsdealer]

Brad was the guy that volunteered to go, and if I were the other guys on the team I would have taken him up on the offer.

+1. That's why Kelly voted for him. Good for Kelly for blasting Mike out of the water in the elimination challenge. I know we're only one episode into this show, but I'm really pulling for Kelly to win the whole enchilada!:thumbup:

MMMM....Enchiladas!!:w00t:

[CJayhawk]

I have never held nor fired a gun in my life, but this show was fascinating (albeit really, really slow.) I think marksmanship is an interesting skill, and seeing how people do with different era and different types of weapons will is intriguing to me.

I agree that the reality-show side of the program is kind of lame. The entire reason the team lost was because of Mike. He was the ENTIRE REASON. Mike and his spotter should have been the two who were in the elimination challenge for that atrocity.

We'll see how pistols go next week.

[Krackin]

I watched the 1st episode and the DVR is setup to record the rest. It seems like a fun show to fast forward through. :)

*SPOILER ALERT*

I was happy that the skilled young guy knocked out the big headed old guy. He didn't just knock him out...he whooped his ass. Can't wait to see how the rest of the guys shoot. :thumbup1:

[The Nid Hog]

I think we've already seen a bit of that. Kelly is a competitive rifle shooter, and the guy that got eliminated was an ex-Marine, wasn't he? I've always thought that every Marine was a rifleman, but apparantly that statement doesn't hold true across the board.:001_rolle

What's an ex-Marine?

[Bertilak]

skilled young guy ... big headed old guy

Well it seemed to me it was the young guy had the swelled head. He is an excellent shot -- AND makes sure everyone knows that AND that everyone KNOWS he knows it.

The "old guy" wasn't actually all that old and certainly did have a bad day. We can't know if that was a fluke or not. We DO know he was quite humble about it. He made no excuses.

[knlgskr]

I think we've already seen a bit of that. Kelly is a competitive rifle shooter, and the guy that got eliminated was an ex-Marine, wasn't he? I've always thought that every Marine was a rifleman, but apparantly that statement doesn't hold true across the board.:001_rolle

All may be riflemen but that doesn't make all of them expert marksmen.

[americanarmsdealer]

What's an ex-Marine?
Sorry, I know better than that. I should have said that he was formerly in the Marines. My bad!:001_rolle

knlgskr, that's true enough, but I can hit a target at 100 yards with a pistol. Mike's shooting was pretty sad to say the least.

[DapperJames]

It's probably the worst excuse for a shooting show that's ever been shown. I think History really laid an egg with this one. First off most of the "contestants" aren't even experts in the field, which is how the show was advertised. Basically it's Survivor with weapons. They should have taken true experts w/ different disciplines and let them learn all the equipment they're going to compete with. Then they could truly compete and compare marksmanship amongst each other to find the true "Top Shot". With this lame "Survivor with firearms" all you’re going to get is the worst contestants voting out the best shooters. They even have a Survivor alumni hosting the show. Waste of what could have been a great show.

[Chadtheguru]

I like it. Last season was a little better due to Kelly, the "underdog." It's still very entertaining to watch. All the competitors are great shooters regardless of whether they're "experts" or not. I think the expert slots are reserved for the coaches.

[stobes21]

I find it entertaining. I like that, by and large, the contestants stay civil with each other and I like that who goes home is ultimately decided by skill rather than by vote. Sure, who goes into the elimination round is decided by vote, but it ultimately comes down to which of the contestants is the better shooter. Plus, the challenges can be pretty cool to watch. I also like that they pull contestants from a variety of competitive and non competitive backgrounds. Certainly you see that even the "experts" have trouble sometimes even in their preferred fields. And some of the competitors pick up a weapon they have never fired in their life and do very well with it.

Ultimately though they shoot what/how I want to shoot. And that's cool. I don't really watch reality shows, but I know I don't want to do that stuff. But I want to do the stuff in top shot. I know I'd get bounced immediately if I were actually in the competition, but I still want to do that. I want to try to make those shots.

[azmark]

I caught the first season marathon before the new one came on. It looks like so much fun and made me go out and shoot at the outdoor range again. Great show.

[riooso]

Last weeks show was great! Ya want to know something? I think Jay the golfer has an excellent chance of winning. The Marines are all falling by the way side, one by one! You have got to chuckle a little because he always seems to pick up his game during the elimination round and murder the competition. His abilities at golf and archery should not be underestimated because both are very much Zen sports and demand a lot of concentration and self control.


Later,
Richard

[azmark]

Last weeks show was great! Ya want to know something? I think Jay the golfer has an excellent chance of winning. The Marines are all falling by the way side, one by one! You have got to chuckle a little because he always seems to pick up his game during the elimination round and murder the competition. His abilities at golf and archery should not be underestimated because both are very much Zen sports and demand a lot of concentration and self control.


Later,
Richard

I've only caught a couple of the earlier episodes and this guy gets on my nerves.

[Ethan.Bassist.]

I'm not a shooter, guns aren't my thing (music and cars are) but I've watched a couple episodes. My only problem is putting them in a house and making them vote people off. If this were a real test of skill you'd essentially vote yourself off by not doing well. But I like how they have all kinds of different competitions and weapons. Like the blowdart one. That one was pretty cool.

...Wait. Do they vote each other off? I could be wrong. I thought there was something about immunity or something. Regardless, I don't like how they live in the same house. It creates drama that is irrelevant and unnecessary. But that's what sells.

[riooso]

I've only caught a couple of the earlier episodes and this guy gets on my nerves.

Same here but still he shows some real grit. You have to admit that a house full of marines would kinda intimidate most anyone.


Richard

[Groat]

When watching this show, I skip straight to practice, watch that for a minute or two, skip to the challenge, watch that, skip to the elimination challenge and that's it. It helps to cut the show down under a half an hour and I only see what I'm actually interested in.

[Commander Quan]

I think Darell said it best, when he said that Jay was "a magician" that guy pulls crap out of his butt every time.

[riooso]

LOL! I don't see how Jay can win. Sometimes I think he is a shill and not reporting his previous experience.....like worked for the CIA and was a crack shot with everything that threw out lethal crap....:blush:


R

[Mako72]

I think the reason Jay is doing so well is his experience with golf. Golf is very much a muscle memory intensive sport. It also throws in reading wind and when playing competitively the the combination of concentration and pressure. Those are key to any sport and especially one on one challenges like the eliminations. It definitely says something about his mental preparedness that he can compete pretty consistantly even when he knows he is probably outclassed on actual shooting experience and technique. Will be interesting to see how much longer he can make it as I expected him to be gone very early and he has held in there well.

Jay

[americanarmsdealer]

I can't believe that Jay is still there! He irritated me from the very beginning of the season when he tried to be the leader of the blue team. Somehow he's still there. I think the thing that bothers me the most about him is his utter disrespect for the experts during practices, and the way he completely disregards their advice that would help him shoot more effectively. Those guys have won competitions and championships for a reason: they actually know what they're talking about and they know what works. And then he somehow pulls magic out of his butt during the eliminations and knocks more experienced people off of the show. Uuughh, another week of having to listen to him.:glare:

[azmark]

It's an interesting show. We've seen pro shooters completely tank and sometimes not hit anything, even with their weapon of choice. Early there was a gal in this season that was a pistol champion and she couldn't hit a target then last season there was a cowboy who was the guy to beat with a colt and stank it up.

IMO to be a good shooter you have to change it up. I can hit just about anything in the range but take me outside and I'm half the shooter I was inside. In Jay's case I think that he is so new that he has not been exposed to habits that shooters depend on and just sticks to the basics.

[letterk]

When watching this show, I skip straight to practice, watch that for a minute or two, skip to the challenge, watch that, skip to the elimination challenge and that's it. It helps to cut the show down under a half an hour and I only see what I'm actually interested in.

After the first two shows, this is what I do as well, now.

[M80]

I'm rooting for Jamie.

[Commander Quan]

If Jamie won that would be great, I also like Ashley. George gets the top D Bag award for this season.

[americanarmsdealer]

If Jamie won that would be great, I also like Ashley. George gets the top D Bag award for this season.

+1! I watched the latest episode last night, and thought it was way uncool how George was complaining that he didn't win the competition, since he hit the 1000 yard target with one shot. He wasn't the fastest time, so he didn't win. What a whiner!

I haven't liked Jay since the season began, but I felt bad for him when he got sent home. For being one of the most inexperienced shooters in the house, I think he really held his own, and he never went back to the house complaining to the other guys about being sent to elimination. Hopefully, George will be the next one out, and Ashley will win the whole thing.

[Chadtheguru]

I'm only half-way through the latest episode... thanks for giving it away. :)

[americanarmsdealer]

I'm only half-way through the latest episode... thanks for giving it away. :)

Caraaaap! Sorry about that!:001_smile

[Chadtheguru]

I kinda figured (hoped so) anyhow.

[M80]

Hell yeah! Go Jamie! :clap:

[Bertilak]

Hell yeah! Go Jamie! :clap:

Most satisfying episode so far. Only could be topped if/when George gets the ax.

Seeing Jay go was second best so far.

[whitemeat640]

I'll agree with everyone on this. Jay had to go. If he was so cocky about things he would have been tolerable but every time the expert (which they all did) asked him to try to switch his grip he blew them off. I cannot wait for next week challenge.

[americanarmsdealer]

[quote=Bertilak;3029906]Most satisfying episode so far. Only could be topped if/when George gets the ax.quote]
+1. I look forward to George getting booted with great excitement.:biggrin1:

[riooso]

I'll agree with everyone on this. Jay had to go. If he was so cocky about things he would have been tolerable but every time the expert (which they all did) asked him to try to switch his grip he blew them off. I cannot wait for next week challenge.

I will say this though about changing his grip just before a high pressure event where one is under pressure if the grip it is not in the muscle memory inventory what you get is a mixture of old and new, and almost no chance of making it. That said, I really think these marines should show some of the respect they themselves demand, and "mocking" is not respectful of anyone. They all knew that Jay did not have the exposure to the training that they all take for granted and was probably not going to make it. If, by chance, you guys are reading this, here are some words of wisdom....behave! I realize that it is a reality show and everyone is competing but ....come on! Show a little class like you did at the Marines dinner!

Besides, none of them probably know how to do a proper wet shave!:biggrin1:


Later,
Richard

[stobes21]

...That said, I really think these marines should show some of the respect they themselves demand, and "mocking" is not respectful of anyone. They all knew that Jay did not have the exposure to the training that they all take for granted and was probably not going to make it. If, by chance, you guys are reading this, here are some words of wisdom....behave! I realize that it is a reality show and everyone is competing but ....come on! Show a little class like you did at the Marines dinner!

Besides, none of them probably know how to do a proper wet shave!:biggrin1:


Later,
Richard

Agreed. Some of the younger military guys (George primarily and Ashley especially this week) have acted like complete and total jerks to those they view as "less worthy." It's one thing to make friends with some guys and not get along particularly well with others. But the name calling and out and out disrespect from those two in particular was unnecessary and in my opinion unprofessional. I want to watch a shooting competition with the best in the world, not the trashy name calling and personal drama from most other reality shows.

[Bertilak]

Well, we Lost Jamie. Having been sent to elimination challenges four times, it may be that in the end he faced and won as many competitions as the ultimate "winner" of the season.

He was the only class act on the show after the first few episodes. I've pretty much lost interest.