Help me choose a new fountain pen.

[Sullybob]

I am looking to get a new fountain pen. I have narrowed my choices down to three pens, a Pilot Vanishing Point, a Pelikan 215 or 205 demonstrator. I have read reviews of these pens at FPN. I have a Lamy that is just ok, I like the style of the pen but it doesn't write as nicely as I would like it to. I have a free pen that came with some Noodlers ink that is much nicer to write with then the Lamy.

Which ever pen I decide on I will order it from Richards pens, so I know that I'm not going to have any problems with the nib. I like a thinner line so I will be getting a fine nib, if that makes any difference.

If you were going to order one of these three pens, which one would you order and why? Is their another pen in a similar price range that I should be looking at?

I should probably tell you that I really like the looks of the Black Carbonesque Vanishing point.

Any insight to these pens would be greatly appreciated

[MaxP]

I cannot speak to the Vanishing Point, but I have two Pelikans and find them very satisfying and trouble free.

[Austin]

I've owned both Pelikan and the Vanishing point. I like the Pelikan better. Nevertheless, they are both solid pens and will not disappoint you.

[SilkySmooth]

For me, the Pelikans and Lamy pens need far less pressure to write with than the Namiki vanishing point. I have the first version Vanishing point. The Nib is very small compared to the other pens. The concept is cool, but I found that I was always trying to press down to get the ink to flow. I also tried various inks with the Namiki and found that the thinner inks worked better.

From my experience, if you're going to do a lot of writing, I'd steer away from the vanishing point. The bladder is very small compared to a Pelikan.

I think demonstrators are pretty cool because they show the ink, and you can get some really neat ink colors. The downside- prepare yourself for a fair amount of cleaning, especially the cap.

You also said that you would like a fine nib. If you order a Pelikan, you may want to order a size down since their nibs tend to run larger/bolder than most manufacturers. www.nibs.com will show you some examples. They also can do custom work to achieve the writing style you're looking for.

In any case, your pen purchase should depend on your intended use.

Happy writing.

[sigman]

I do not like the vanishing point. Do not remember anything remarkable about the other pens you have mentioned.

I settled on a sheaffer agio, very nice pen for the money i paid. All of $20.

[Sullybob]

Thanks guys. It seems that the Pelikan is favored over the vanishing point.

My intended use for the pen is to use it everyday. I may or may not use it in school to take notes with so the bladder size of the vanishing point could be an issue.

Why do demonstrators need the cap cleaned more then other pens?

[Bill Smith]

My suggestion, save up some more money and get the Pelikan M400. I have the Vanishing Point as well, it's a great pen but I think you are headed towards Pelikan in your decision making.

[Isaac]

I would recommend the Pelikan over the Vanishing Point. I find the ink capacity of the Vanishing Point to be very lacking personally.

[StylinLA]

I'm a fan of the Vanishing Point. I've also got a Waterman and an over the top pricey Tiffany that I got for my 20 years on the job.

The Waterman is a nice quality pen no doubt. But I like to carry a pen for work. It's hard to beat the ease of use which the click open Vanishing Point offers.
Pretty cumbersome to keep pulling the cap off the Waterman.

The Tiffany is nice, and probably has the finest quality nib. But it's a pain in the azz to load with ink and doesn't hold much. Very high maintenance.

It is a little tricky to get used to the way the pocket clip on the VP is positioned when turning pen around to write, but you'll get it.

There is also a "cool- a retractable fountain pen!" aspect to the VP.

I'm sure they're well designed, but I am anticipating an ink disaster of some kind though.

[Razor&Pens]

There is a lot to reply to in this thread. Both the Pelikans and the Vanishing Point (VP) are very nice pens. (Richard doesn't sell pens that do not perform or last up to his high standards.)

If you like really fine lines, Japanese nibs run fine, so a fine VP will be finer than a fine Pelikan, assuming you are not going to get one of Richard's custom nibs anyhow.

The Vanishing Point is a little quirkier in that the clip forces you to hold the pen a certain way. I have never had a problem with it but as some people do, it would be good if you could test drive one first. (You should *not* have to press down with it more than any other pen.

The VP will hold less ink than one of the Pelikans, but the VP can use a (proprietary Pilot) cartridge, which offers that kind of flexibility versus the larger capacity, but bottle-fill-only Pelikan. The VP is operates like a ballpoint thus it is one handed open/close and there is no cap to drop. The Pelikan is a traditional design.

The Pelikan demonstrators are the identical design to the non-demonstrators. If you're anal about the appearance, you might be bothered by any stray ink in the cap, under the inner cap, etc.

I have multiple Vanishing Points and Pelikans, both demonstrators and not. If the VP clip position is not a deal-breaker for you, they are both great pens and each offers pros & cons.

Wonderful dilema with which to be faced. :) (And say hello to Richard for me, and that I'll see him at the Philly show in a few weeks.)

-Tom

[Sullybob]

Thanks for all of the input guys. I have a lot to think about before making my final decision. Tough decision indeed.

[Torcams]

I just unwrapped (late xmas) a new Pelikan 215 today (black with lozenges). Got the pen from Richard and it looks fantastic and writes beautifully. First fill (besides by Richard) was with Waterman Florida Blue.

I did a bunch of lurking on FPN and browsing through various options before settling on this one.

[Cheech]

For daily use, I'd have to recommend the VP. This feels odd, because I am a huge fan of Pelikans, and generally prefer them over pretty much all other pens I own.

For me, the convenience of a retractable pen is fairly big. This may also depend on how you use your pens. I jot frequently through the day, and fairly regularly write a few paragraphs. Because of this, the ease of being able to pull the VP out of my pocket, click, and write; is a major factor.

Two things to be considered, which may make your decision process very easy:

1. The VP is a fairly thick pen.
2. As was mentioned earlier, the clip may or may not work with your writing style. I actually adjusted to the pen. At first, I was going to get rid of it. Then a friend suggested I give it a couple of days. Now, I love my VP.

It looks like you should have a Paradise Pen and a Colorado Pen nearby. I've been to the Paradise Pen in Las Vegas, and was really impressed by them. I'd say take the day and check out the VP. See how you like the feel and clip position. Heck, while you're there you can check out the Pelikan. Always better to make a decision after you've had them both in your hand.

[winkydink]

I <3 my Pilot Vanishing Point. It's the only FP I own that is always inked (Private Reserve Black Magic Blue).

Get one from RichardsPens.com (http://www.richardspens.com/) and he'll tune (i.e., tweak) the nib for you so it's not as finicky about the position it needs to be held in.

[Bill Smith]

Now to defend the Pilot VP (I'm using mine today), I think it's performance depends on the ink. Use something that's on the thick side, it will not perform to your liking. I have Omas Blue in my VP this morning and the flow is great.

[WhosYerBob]

Pelikan has my vote. I've owned a bunch of them over the years and finally settled on an 805. One thing that few other pen makers can offer is your choice of user changeable nibs, including italic and customized nibs from the nibmeisters.

[Cheech]

Good point about the nibs. The VP nibs are easily changed, also. The set-up is a little different, but you're not stuck with the nib with which you ordered.

[Sullybob]

I knew the VP has a nib that is easily changed but I didn't know that that the Pelikan's nib was also changed easily. That makes the choice even tougher.

I should be able to hold a VP tomorrow and possibly a Pelikan also.

[D.Irving79]

conklin crescent filler

any eyedropper with a good nib

[Razor&Pens]

Another easy solution--Get both!

Why didn't I think of that sooner?

[Cheech]

Sometimes, the solution is right in front of your nose!

Seriously, either way you go, you're choosing between two amazing pens. You're making the envious choice of which is "better," v. which is less bad. The latter choice has become all too much the norm these days.

Both Pelikan and Namiki have a true dedication to producing quality products. The question is not whether one is better than the other, but which one suits you best.

Of course, after you buy one, the other isn't far behind. :thumbup:

[Sullybob]

conklin crescent filler

any eyedropper with a good nib

I searched for Conklin crescent fillers. Those are some interesting pens. I only found one that was in the price range that I am looking at. I'll have to keep my eye out for them in antique shops.

Why an eye dropper? Do you have any recommendations?


Another easy solution--Get both!

Why didn't I think of that sooner?

:001_smile
Yeah, thanks. Enabler...
Eventually I'll get another pen, so I will more then likely end up with the other one.


Sometimes, the solution is right in front of your nose!

Seriously, either way you go, you're choosing between two amazing pens. You're making the envious choice of which is "better," v. which is less bad. The latter choice has become all too much the norm these days.

Both Pelikan and Namiki have a true dedication to producing quality products. The question is not whether one is better than the other, but which one suits you best.

Of course, after you buy one, the other isn't far behind. :thumbup:

True, both of these pens are great. Maybe next Christmas I'll get the other pen. Or maybe sooner.

[Sullybob]

I ordered the Pilot Vanishing Point, Black Carbonesque from Richards Pens.
They are currently on vacation for the Holidays and won't be back until he 6th.

I will update this thread after I have used the pen for a while.

Thanks for all the points of view, impressions and advice.

[Tobacco]

Another easy solution--Get both!

Why didn't I think of that sooner?

Lol. Agree. I write with a Pelikan though.

[D.Irving79]

an eyedropper is just a fun, nostalgic pen to have. its my favorite though b/c its easy to maintain. there were MANY different ones. mine is a federal.

[kingfisher]

You'll love the Vanishing Point. For my money, Pilot makes the best nibs going, especially if you like a fine or very fine line, as I do. Pelikan pens are wonderful but their nibs tend to run wide. Pilots, on the other hand, write just the way I want them to, and they're very reliable, just like a Pelikan.

[StylinLA]

I ordered the Pilot Vanishing Point, Black Carbonesque from Richards Pens.

That's the exact same one I have. I think you'll enjoy it once you get used to gripping it working around the clip.

[smoothshaver]

I'm late to this thread, but here's my 2 cents. I love my VPs. The carbonesque finishes (I have a blue one) are great. And there are times when a retractable FP is convenient. I use a syringe to refill Pilot cartridges, which hold more ink than their converters.

[Sullybob]

You're not too late at all Ed. One more positive recommendation is a good thing, for me. I was under the impression that the VP nibs had a built in converter. If not, then I am going to need to order one.

The finish on the carbonesque was a selling point for me. The faux carbon fiber looks great.

[mparker762]

You're not too late at all Ed. One more positive recommendation is a good thing, for me. I was under the impression that the VP nibs had a built in converter. If not, then I am going to need to order one.

I believe the VP comes with a CON-20 bladder-fill converter, which has a pretty small capacity. It's worth ordering the CON-50 piston-fill converter IMO, but the suggestion to use a syringe and refill the cartridges is also a good one since the cartridges have a much larger capacity than even the piston fill converter due to the lack of space taken by the piston mechanism.

[winkydink]

The one I ordered from Richard came with a converter.

[smoothshaver]

Let me try to clarify. As I recall, these pens come with a converter already in place in the nib assembly. (The retracting mechanism makes these pens a little different from a "standard" fountain pen. A metal tube extends beyond the nib and feed. The cartridge or converter fits into this tube.). The converter should pull out of the nib assembly. {This makes more sense when actually looking at a VP's insides, at least I hope it does. :001_smile}

The pen also comes with a cartridge and a metal holder for it. The metal holder protects the cartridge from the retracting mechanism's workings. The cartridge goes inside the holder and together they fit into the nib assembly.

I hope I haven't gotten you more confused. :001_huh: Enjoy your terrific new pen.

PS: My VP came with a piston converter. I tried it, but quickly decided to stick with refilling cartridges. Not only does the converter have a small capacity, it's a bother to use.

[Sullybob]

I believe the VP comes with a CON-20 bladder-fill converter, which has a pretty small capacity. It's worth ordering the CON-50 piston-fill converter IMO, but the suggestion to use a syringe and refill the cartridges is also a good one since the cartridges have a much larger capacity than even the piston fill converter due to the lack of space taken by the piston mechanism.

Thanks. If I find that I am filling the pen more often then I like I'll order the CON-50.


Let me try to clarify. As I recall, these pens come with a converter already in place in the nib assembly. (The retracting mechanism makes these pens a little different from a "standard" fountain pen. A metal tube extends beyond the nib and feed. The cartridge or converter fits into this tube.). The converter should pull out of the nib assembly. {This makes more sense when actually looking at a VP's insides, at least I hope it does. :001_smile}

The pen also comes with a cartridge and a metal holder for it. The metal holder protects the cartridge from the retracting mechanism's workings. The cartridge goes inside the holder and together they fit into the nib assembly.

I hope I haven't gotten you more confused. :001_huh: Enjoy your terrific new pen.

Nope, you didn't confuse me at all. It should ship out on the 6th, maybe I'll have it early next week. I'm pretty excited for it to arrive.

[Cheech]

I think the CON-50 is the piston converter, and the CON-20 is the bladder filler. I don't know if the CON-20 will fit the VP. I've always been OK with the load size of the piston converter, so I've never explored the bladder.

[Sullybob]

I have had the VP for about a week and I am really liking it.

My initial impression of the pen was really favorable. The box that it came in was pretty darn nice. The pen feels like a tool in my hand, substantial and strong. The placement of the clip is a non-issue, I don't even realize it's there when I write with it. It was very easy to fill the pen, the converter works great.

How does it write? Smooth, slick and easy. Its like pushing an ice cube around on a warm glass plate.

Thanks for all the advice, recommendations and general thoughts on your pens.

[smoothshaver]

Congratulations! :thumbup1:
I'm glad you're enjoying your new pen.