Help me with knife sharpening

[mretzloff]

Yes, I searched, and yes I read that long thread on knife sharpening (thanks for the videos, Ouch).

I have a Shun chef's knife and a 1000/4000 Norton. I let the stone sit in water for twenty minutes and then run the Shun over the 1000 side. The problem is, I cannot feel a burr, ever. What could the problem be?

[TimmyBoston]

Buy a Spyderco Sharpmaker. Much, much easier for sharpening knives.

[tsmba]

Personally, I think sharpening gimmicks are a waste of cash. You have adequate stones....putting out the effort to learn how to use them will be worth the effort. Feeling the burr isn't easy with harder steels.

[DS/B MCS]

Buy a Spyderco Sharpmaker. Much, much easier for sharpening knives.

+1

All I have ever needed for any of my knives. Keeping the edge maintained is the key. Spyderco also makes diamond hones for the Sharpmaker if you need something a little more aggressive.

[Emmett]

Yes, I searched, and yes I read that long thread on knife sharpening (thanks for the videos, Ouch).

I have a Shun chef's knife and a 1000/4000 Norton. I let the stone sit in water for twenty minutes and then run the Shun over the 1000 side. The problem is, I cannot feel a burr, ever. What could the problem be?

How's your angle? I thought I was doing it right but it turned out my angle was way too small and all I was doing was putting honewear on the sides of my blades.

[stobes21]

Buy a Spyderco Sharpmaker. Much, much easier for sharpening knives.

+2. The Sharpmaker isn't a gimmick, it's a set of quality stones that are held in a way that make it easier to sharpen a knife than a traditional bench stone. I have sharpened many knives from little pocket knives up through large kitchen knives on mine and have been very pleased with it.

As for the OP, I think that 1000 grit norton is way too fine for a kitchen knife. You will probably have more success starting on a much coarser stone and maybe doing your finish on the 1000 (though I prefer my kitchen knifes a bit rougher as it seems to improve cutting performance).

[mretzloff]

Feeling the burr isn't easy with harder steels.

I think that is the problem. I will try getting it down with some cheap knives and then tackle my Shun.

[mretzloff]

As for the OP, I think that 1000 grit norton is way too fine for a kitchen knife. You will probably have more success starting on a much coarser stone and maybe doing your finish on the 1000 (though I prefer my kitchen knifes a bit rougher as it seems to improve cutting performance).

Do you really think so? See, my logic was that 1000 would be enough because the Shun comes very sharp out of the box and I have only used it for a year (with honings before every use). Of course, I am no knife expert, so you are probably right.

[redbike]

I take mine to a professional at a cooking store. No messing with stones & burrs for me.

[mretzloff]

I take mine to a professional at a cooking store. No messing with stones & burrs for me.

I would do the same, but Sur La Table (the cooking store in my area) uses electric sharpeners.

[citizensoldierny]

Buy a Spyderco Sharpmaker. Much, much easier for sharpening knives.

+1, takes all the guess work out of knife sharpening. I have at least 3 knife sharpening systems in addition to many stones, benchgrinder, pocket diamond rods, etc. and the sharpmaker is the best . It is versatile, consistent, and easy to learn how to use. Probably the best $50 I've spent for my knife collection ever.

[TimmyBoston]

I would do the same, but Sur La Table (the cooking store in my area) uses electric sharpeners.

There's one of those near me, too. I've never used it, but some of my friends have and the results were less than impressive.

[ouch]

I never used the Sharpmaker, but it seems that everyone who has reports good results.

If your knife is pretty dull, it may take quite a while to raise a burr with a 1K stone. When you do manage to raise one with a 1K, it's usually readily indentifiable. Burrs formed with finer stones are easier to miss.

It's the same as instructions for getting to Carnegie Hall- practice, practice, practice.

[mretzloff]

Ouch, I was wondering where you were. My knife is not dull at all, I am just going by the "sharpen once a year" thing.

I may try that Spyderco Sharpmaker. I watched some YouTube videos and it seems really easy. Do you just run the knife along the rods?

[stobes21]

Yep. You move the knife straight down and the knife is held at the correct angle. It comes with coarse and fine stones and you can buy diamond stones if you need them.

[mogsman]

You could always take it to your local butcher. Thats what I used to do before I worked in the trade.
Ian

[Suzuki]

The Sharpmaker is an excellent tool - I have all of the stones from the coarse diamond stones all the way up to the ultra-finestones. While not as idiot-proof as a pull-through sharpener, as stated above, you are using a quality set of stones. My two beefs are that, unless you have the diamond stones, it can take a very long time to set the bevel the first time you use it and its a bit fiddly to get the tips as sharp as the rest of the blade. In my view, this is the best sharpening contraption out there - largely because of the quality of the stones. It is not as easy as the pull through gadgets, but I am able to consistently get knives to shaving sharp. I am moving on to freehand sharpening, but still use the Sharpmaker for pocketknives, less expensive kitchen knives, etc.

The real issue with any sharpening method is that the first time you use it, it may not be set at the exact same angle as the factory bevel - this is especially so with freehand sharpening. This means that, in many cases, the first time you sharpen a knife, you are, to some degree, resetting the bevel (unless you are spot on to the factory bevel) - which translates into more work before the burr stage.

I've always found the first sharpening of a knife to be a pain in the rump for this reason and trying to do this on a 1000 grit stone can take a long time. That's why I got the diamond stones for my Sharpmaker and why I use my Norton 220 grit for the initial bevel setting - what used to take 15 minutes now takes 5. You do need to be careful, as you can remove a fair bit of metal quickly on such a coarse grit.

I sometimes have a hard time feeling the burr, but with practice have gotten better at it - at the initial bevel setting phase, looking along the cutting edge to see if there are any reflections (which indicate that the edge has not been sharpened to the stage where both sides meet), keeping an eye on the width of the bevel to see if its approximately even on both sides (to make sure that you're not using significantly different angles on different sides).

More important than the burr is how your knives feel - even off of the 1000 stone, you should have a very sharp knife that can slice tomatoes without too much trouble.

Keep at it, if you like to cook and like sharp knives, learning to sharpen your own with stones is a great skill to have - there's nothing like having a knife that can slice tomatoes paper thin just by looking at them and knowing that you're the one who got it that sharp.

[ouch]

My knife is not dull at all, I am just going by the "sharpen once a year" thing.

I f you haven't sharpened you knife for a year, it is dull. :001_tongu

[Sluggo]

Not to Hijack this thread, but what do you "knifeies"think of this method?
http://www.thesharpbrothers.com/

[mretzloff]

Thank you guys.

[Scotto]

As mentioned, it can take a while to raise a burr with a 1k stone. Also, try using the tip of your thumbnail to feel the edge - it should catch on the burr.

Real men sharpen free hand, BTW.... :sleep:

[NoFair]

Colour the edge with a marker and see if your honing removes the ink on the edge. If it doesn't raise the spine until it does.

I normally strop my kitchen knives on an old razor leather/fabric strop.

[tsmba]

I've purchased honing guides, Chef's Choice sharpeners, and other devices that supposedly "make sharpening easier". All sit on the shelf gathering dust. I have yet to find anything that can be achieved with these devices that cannot be done better with the proper stones. Taking the time to learn to execute a task correctly pays off!

[mretzloff]

Real men sharpen free hand, BTW.... :sleep:

What is "free hand"?

[NoFair]

What is "free hand"?

Sharpening without a clamp/guide or other system. Just hands, stone and knife in other words. Once you have done it a while it it fast and natural and you get the angles right.

Chromium oxide loaded strops also work great on kitchen knives. Fast and easy to maintain a very high level of sharpness. A couple of mine are very close to "shave ready" standard for a straight razor:biggrin:

[Dharion]

I'm a total noob at honing pocket knives :001_unsur Though I've just sharpened my two kitchen knives on a Naniwa 1k/3k. Once you've got the correct angle you're all set.

[ouch]

What is "free hand"?

While shaving, real men will simultaneously sharpen their knives, using their "free hand".

[Protocol]

I have used all manner of jigs, mechanical sharpeners, sticks, stones, and what not. I was initially pretty skeptical about the Spyderco Tri-Angle Sharpmaker, but am now a true believer. That is one hell of a system.

One tip I'd also recommend is to look down the edge of your blade. You will not be able to feel the bur, necessarily, but you will almost certainly be able to see the glint of the bur reflected back at you from an overhead light.