Ladies and Gentleman Are You Offended?

[SRock]

This is not an endorsement of this site however, I found this article (http://www.thefrisky.com/post/246-what-does-gentleman-mean-these-days/) interesting.

I can't imagine being offended by being referred to as a Gentlemen.

[Jim]

The sky is falling!

[Leche]

I don't know any women who would be offended by being called a Lady. Guess I know the good ones.:confused:

[SRock]

The sky is falling!

Seriously!


I don't know any women who would be offended by being called a Lady. Guess I know the good ones.:confused:

Exactly!

[Tom C]

I've been aware of the stigma attached to the word "lady" since the '70s when my sister informed me that it was a no-no (she was reading Ms. magazine in high school). The writer of that article is just a bit behind the times.

[SRock]

I've been aware of the stigma attached to the word "lady" since the '70s when my sister informed me that it was a no-no (she was reading Ms. magazine in high school). The writer of that article is just a bit behind the times.

Behind the times or just as screwy as whomever authored the article in Ms. magazine back in the 70's?

[blackfoot]

I must be oblivious. I was not aware there is a problem with the term lady. :confused:

[SRock]

I must be oblivious. I was not aware there is a problem with the term lady. :confused:

Seriously I say it in honor of a woman. A lady is the epitome of womanhood.

[chfair]

my GF hates being called a lady, even a young lady, her reason is it makes her feel old. while i on the other hand like the term gentleman and lady because of what i was traditionally taught they stood for. very few of the people in my age range use these terms, when i hear them the most is opening doors for the more elderly. hard words to come by on a college campus, i think it is a shame.

[Sue]

I must be oblivious. I was not aware there is a problem with the term lady. :confused:


I wonder why no one told me? .......I'm always the last to know.
Sue

[SRock]

I wonder why no one told me? .......I'm always the last to know.
Sue

But Sue, you definitely are a Lady and there is nothing wrong with that at all!

[Emmett]

I was aware of this and know no woman my age who wants to be called a lady.

[SpyvSpy]

If a lady doesn't like being called a "lady" then she probly doesn't act like one.

[Jethro1984]

What's next? Is someone going to tell me that saying "Hello" is rude?

[Koss]

I just laugh at all labels and titles anyways. A sly smile always crosses my face when someone calls me Sir, or Mister.

I can't wait until I would technically have the right to demand that I be called Doctor. But a doctorate is still so far away currently. :biggrin:

[Jethro1984]

I just laugh at all labels and titles anyways. A sly smile always crosses my face when someone calls me Sir, or Mister.

I can't wait until I would technically have the right to demand that I be called Doctor. But a doctorate is still so far away currently. :biggrin:

Best of luck in your collegiate adventures Doctor...........:biggrin:

[SpyvSpy]

I just laugh at all labels and titles anyways. A sly smile always crosses my face when someone calls me Sir, or Mister.

I can't wait until I would technically have the right to demand that I be called Doctor. But a doctorate is still so far away currently. :biggrin:

Best of luck to you.

[Koss]

Best of luck in your collegiate adventures Doctor...........:biggrin:


Best of luck to you.

Why thank you both kind Sirs! The two of you are both fine gentlemen and scholars! :001_tongu

But yes, thank you :001_smile

[Johnny Dale]

I'm still trying to get my mind wrapped around "retro gender construct". :confused:

Maybe after another cup of coffee I can figure it out.


If a lady doesn't like being called a "lady" then she probly doesn't act like one.

+1 :thumbup1:

[pmast]

I just laugh at all labels and titles anyways. A sly smile always crosses my face when someone calls me Sir, or Mister.

I can't wait until I would technically have the right to demand that I be called Doctor. But a doctorate is still so far away currently. :biggrin:


My brother has a PhD and an MD, he can demand all he wants, I'm not calling him Dr.:001_tt2: Seriously, good luck! I know how much work you have to put in to get there and it does deserve a bit of respect.

[blackfoot]

I Think it is funny when I use Ma'am, particularly when talking to women under 30. It seems to take them by surprise. That also saddens me.

[Millay]

This has seriously confused me, i mean. i always refer to women as ladies, non have ever taken offence buy it,

[professorchaos]

I call women ladies, when merited, say ma'am and open doors. Any who might take offense to that don't last long in my world. I like women to act like ladies. In return I act like a gentleman.

"Retro gender construct?" Sounds like intellectual pretentiousness to me. You know, dim people trying to sound bright.

[mainaman]

Unfortunately today's women might have a skewed understanding of what lady means. Whatever the movies show is pretty much what the perception is, but it looks like the concept of being a lady is totally missed.. I do not pretend to know what lady really means, but it for sure has to do with manners, way of life , way of dressing, way of behaving , and also a society status.

[mmack66]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xolPe6K_zk#t=2m32s

[KarthVader]

I'm caught in a conundrum. I was raised to be a polite, genuine and thoughtful gentleman.

I don't mean to offend or ostracize, but I feel very strongly that "ladies" have taken advantage of people like me. In fact, I think women have taken people like me for granted.

Now, I have become slightly brutish and even slightly misogynist (unfortunately) because of this. I came up with an idea/theory called Advantageous Feminism (AF). Basically, women that I've met from all places and backgrounds seem to employ this. They will be independent and dependent when it suits them i.e. uber-feminist one moment then uber feminine and helpless the next. I'm not saying that it has to be all one way or another, but I feel like I no longer need to be a gentleman; I can be a total a$$h0l3 and not really care what women think of me because only my and my family's opinion matters to me. It is a double standard of the worst kind.

Granted, I get extremely irritated in the face of this AF and I have become apathetic. I hate being like that because it is counterintuitive to my character and personality. To get back to the original argument, I think that being a gentlemen or lady has been eliminated due to the lack of chivalrous behavior. Chivalry and gentlemanly behavior are not codependent, but they have been associated with each other. I do think one can be a gentleman and not necessarily be chivalrous.

Is it a paradigm shift? Are we slowly eliminating our gender differences? If that's the case, then we're all going to experience a rude awakening soon and we should adapt quickly. I hope that there is a quantum of discipline left in people to conduct themselves accordingly. I'm not for women acting docile and being stuck in "traditional" feminine roles or men to act like jerks, but for everyone to be polite and genuine; no beating around the bush or deception.

Again, if this post offends you, I apologize. I am just speaking the truth from my perception.

[ouch]

This is not an endorsement of this site however, I found this article (http://www.thefrisky.com/post/246-what-does-gentleman-mean-these-days/) interesting.

I can't imagine being offended by being referred to as a Gentlemen.

Why, where I come from, them's fightin' words. Fortunately, I ain't where I come from.


But more importantly, what are your thoughts on Levi Johnston? :rolleyes:


We always have to be careful with our links.

[mmack66]

The real question is why is SlagleRock spending time at thefrisky.com? :biggrin:

[Cutter]

I had a dog once that I named Lady...Now I feel bad.

[blackfoot]

The real question is why is SlagleRock spending time at thefrisky.com? :biggrin:

Hey, what Superman does in his off time is none of my business. :cool:

[Tom C]

If a lady doesn't like being called a "lady" then she probly doesn't act like one.

Now that's offensive. Way to stay classy! :rolleyes:

[blackfoot]

Now that's offensive. Way to stay classy! :rolleyes:

You stay classy, San Diego!

[Sue]

I'm caught in a conundrum. I was raised to be a polite, genuine and thoughtful gentleman.

I don't mean to offend or ostracize, but I feel very strongly that "ladies" have taken advantage of people like me. In fact, I think women have taken people like me for granted.

Now, I have become slightly brutish and even slightly misogynist (unfortunately) because of this. I came up with an idea/theory called Advantageous Feminism (AF). Basically, women that I've met from all places and backgrounds seem to employ this. They will be independent and dependent when it suits them i.e. uber-feminist one moment then uber feminine and helpless the next. I'm not saying that it has to be all one way or another, but I feel like I no longer need to be a gentleman; I can be a total a$$h0l3 and not really care what women think of me because only my and my family's opinion matters to me. It is a double standard of the worst kind.

Granted, I get extremely irritated in the face of this AF and I have become apathetic. I hate being like that because it is counterintuitive to my character and personality. To get back to the original argument, I think that being a gentlemen or lady has been eliminated due to the lack of chivalrous behavior. Chivalry and gentlemanly behavior are not codependent, but they have been associated with each other. I do think one can be a gentleman and not necessarily be chivalrous.

Is it a paradigm shift? Are we slowly eliminating our gender differences? If that's the case, then we're all going to experience a rude awakening soon and we should adapt quickly. I hope that there is a quantum of discipline left in people to conduct themselves accordingly. I'm not for women acting docile and being stuck in "traditional" feminine roles or men to act like jerks, but for everyone to be polite and genuine; no beating around the bush or deception.

Again, if this post offends you, I apologize. I am just speaking the truth from my perception.


Well, just don't then.

If you know you are being an A..h.... wouldn't you expect to draw a person of similar characteristic? I know a few A'H's; most of their friends are too. The term usually changes to B---h when it's a female; sum up the character traits something like this: uncaring, calculating, a 'user' and 'taker', unthoughtful, zero compassion and self indulgent. What can you do for me is a priority.

"Real" people, men or women don't act in a certain way to suit the situation; you are or you're not. It's how you conduct yourself and that includes honesty. The men in my life are gentlemen and I was raised by a true gentleman. If I help you shingle your roof or pump the gas in your car and check the oil, am I less of a lady? Being a lady is not about being helpless, or the damsel in distress. A lady or gentleman is conduct, values and principles then adhering to them. Sometimes, doing the right thing is tough but do it anyway.

Well, thats my dime (inflation) if it matters.
Sue

[_JP_]

I can't imagine being offended by being referred to as a Gentlemen.

I'm reminded of what I used to hear when I lived on military bases. If someone called one of the enlisted "Sir" the response sometimes was, "Don't call me Sir, I work for a living."

[Ru4scuba?]

If I had a dime every time a woman told me not to call her "Ma'am" and that it was old fashioned...maybe its just an old term thats gone the way of the do do bird...

That said, I really liked Sue's post. A "Lady" can be defined in many ways, but I think she nailed how ladies and gentlemen both can be defined...

[Doc4]

A lady is the epitome of womanhood.


But Sue, you definitely are a Lady


Why thank you both kind Sirs! The two of you are both fine gentlemen and scholars! :001_tongu




I use Ma'am, particularly when talking to women under 30.


i always refer to women as ladies


I call women ladies, when merited, say ma'am and open doors.


I was raised to be a polite, genuine and thoughtful gentleman.




I had a dog once that I named Lady.

Look at all these offensive posts ... using such offensive terms as "lady" and "gentleman" and such. If this continues, I'll have to lock this thread.












:wink2:

[pmast]

Well, just don't then.

If you know you are being an A..h.... wouldn't you expect to draw a person of similar characteristic? I know a few A'H's; most of their friends are too. The term usually changes to B---h when it's a female; sum up the character traits something like this: uncaring, calculating, a 'user' and 'taker', unthoughtful, zero compassion and self indulgent. What can you do for me is a priority.

"Real" people, men or women don't act in a certain way to suit the situation; you are or you're not. It's how you conduct yourself and that includes honesty. The men in my life are gentlemen and I was raised by a true gentleman. If I help you shingle your roof or pump the gas in your car and check the oil, am I less of a lady? Being a lady is not about being helpless, or the damsel in distress. A lady or gentleman is conduct, values and principles then adhering to them. Sometimes, doing the right thing is tough but do it anyway.

Well, thats my dime (inflation) if it matters.
Sue



Well said! I understand exactly and many women do enjoy using the double standard and many men are just as manipulative, but that should not impair your integrity or lower your standards of conduct or behavior. There are too few people with the grit and integrity to do the right thing now anyway. We need all the gentlemen and ladies we can find in this day and age.

[RazorDingo]

It's the same thing with the feminists. You know, they want everything to be equal... everything! But when the check comes, where are they?

George Costana

Not to take this too far off topic, but does anyone notice how degraded the word gentleman has become?

Examples:

Police Officer: "We're looking for the gentlemen who robbed the liquor store..."

Bar Owner: ".. and then the gentleman in the t-shirt vomited on the pool table.."

I think we've all heard people using the word "gentleman" to describe individuals who have engaged in behavior that is far from gentlemanly. I recognize that society has come a way since the term was used, exclusively, to describe a man who did not have to work, with his hands, for a living. But I still don't think we should be using it to describe murderers and thugs.

[82R100]

Not to take this too far off topic, but does anyone notice how degraded the word gentleman has become?

Examples:

Police Officer: "We're looking for the gentlemen who robbed the liquor store..."

Bar Owner: ".. and then the gentleman in the t-shirt vomited on the pool table.."

I think we've all heard people using the word "gentleman" to describe individuals who have engaged in behavior that is far from gentlemanly. I recognize that society has come a way since the term was used, exclusively, to describe a man who did not have to work, with his hands, for a living. But I still don't think we should be using it to describe murderers and thugs.

That's not what I take from it at all. The policeman and bar owner are taking the high road by using the same honorific they use for any of their clients. They'd gain nothing by referring to each as a "lowdown dirtball scum" would they? Instead I think it speaks of professionalism.

- Chris

[TheHatter]

The title was a simple question, so I'll try to give a simple answer. No. I have never and will never be offended by being referred to as a gentleman.

[blackfoot]

That's not what I take from it at all. The policeman and bar owner are taking the high road by using the same honorific they use for any of their clients. They'd gain nothing by referring to each as a "lowdown dirtball scum" would they? Instead I think it speaks of professionalism.

- Chris

+1 I can tell you first hand, that is not the term they are using when they are out of public view. :biggrin:

[SRock]

I was aware of this and know no woman my age who wants to be called a lady.

How old are you? My wife is 26 and finds it quite honorable to be referred to as a Lady or "Young Lady" by the older generation.


If a lady doesn't like being called a "lady" then she probly doesn't act like one.

I think there may be some truth to this statement.


I Think it is funny when I use Ma'am, particularly when talking to women under 30. It seems to take them by surprise. That also saddens me.

This one never seemed odd to me. Ma'am is the correct term to address a female officer. The average 2d LT is 22-23 yrs old. But I can see how outside of the military Ma'am may have older lady connotations.


I call women ladies, when merited, say ma'am and open doors. Any who might take offense to that don't last long in my world. I like women to act like ladies. In return I act like a gentleman.

"Retro gender construct?" Sounds like intellectual pretentiousness to me. You know, dim people trying to sound bright.

+1


Why, where I come from, them's fightin' words. Fortunately, I ain't where I come from.


But more importantly, what are your thoughts on Levi Johnston? :rolleyes:


We always have to be careful with our links.

+1 I didn't really mill around the site until after this thread was started.


The real question is why is SlagleRock spending time at thefrisky.com? :biggrin:

:lol: See comment above. Truth is a buddy of mine who knows I pride myself of being a gentlemen sent me the link. Now, I'll have to ask him what he's doing spending time at that site!


Hey, what Superman does in his off time is none of my business. :cool:

:lol:

[Emmett]

Slagle, I'm 26 as well. I do tend to hang around feminists so I'm guessing that has something to do with it.

[SRock]

Slagle, I'm 26 as well. I do tend to hang around feminists so I'm guessing that has something to do with it.

Ah, that may explain it! :tongue:

[Stubblefield]

What's next? Is someone going to tell me that saying "Hello" is rude?You must have missed the memo. :smile:

[SRock]

You must have missed the memo. :smile:

'Sup yo! :biggrin:

[KarthVader]

Well, just don't then.

If you know you are being an A..h.... wouldn't you expect to draw a person of similar characteristic? I know a few A'H's; most of their friends are too. The term usually changes to B---h when it's a female; sum up the character traits something like this: uncaring, calculating, a 'user' and 'taker', unthoughtful, zero compassion and self indulgent. What can you do for me is a priority.

"Real" people, men or women don't act in a certain way to suit the situation; you are or you're not. It's how you conduct yourself and that includes honesty. The men in my life are gentlemen and I was raised by a true gentleman. If I help you shingle your roof or pump the gas in your car and check the oil, am I less of a lady? Being a lady is not about being helpless, or the damsel in distress. A lady or gentleman is conduct, values and principles then adhering to them. Sometimes, doing the right thing is tough but do it anyway.

Well, thats my dime (inflation) if it matters.
Sue

Sue, I guess I'm just frustrated because some people my age (early 20s) act like morons and it gets very difficult always being the person doing the right thing and NOT acting like an AH. The self satisfaction I get is more than enough, and I would never expect someone to praise me for being a gentleman. I just wish people that acted like AH wouldn't get away with it.

But your absolutely right, I shouldn't let my environment affect my mood and behavior. I should just remain the gen*****nly one. :smile:

Sorry for all the gen*****nly profanity!:tongue:

[SRock]

sue, i guess i'm just frustrated because some people my age (early 20s) act like morons and it gets very difficult always being the person doing the right thing and not acting like an ah. The self satisfaction i get is more than enough, and i would never expect someone to praise me for being a gentleman. I just wish people that acted like ah wouldn't get away with it.

but your absolutely right, i shouldn't let my environment affect my mood and behavior. i should just remain the gen*****nly one. :smile:

Sorry for all the gen*****nly profanity!:tongue:

+1

[HankG]

If a lady doesn't like being called a "lady" then she probly doesn't act like one.

This is a good post. The guy who wrote that article shouldn't have even apologized. He should have just replied and said, "Judging from your comments, I obviously wasn't including you when I used the term 'lady'."

[Johnny_Z]

The problem I have with the term gentleman is the fact that they are born, not made. If you are born into a family with money and land, you are a gentleman. Being polite, dressing well (whatever that means) and all the other trappings have nothing to do with it. You are born a gentleman or you aren't. You might be the most retched, horrible person alive, but if you have money you have the title. If you're poor, no amount of suits in the closet or manners will make you one. That's why all masons refer to one another as brother, as not everyone in the lodge would have been "of gentle birth".

I for one don't like the term or use it in reference to myself.

[SRock]

The problem I have with the term gentleman is the fact that they are born, not made. If you are born into a family with money and land, you are a gentleman. Being polite, dressing well (whatever that means) and all the other trappings have nothing to do with it. You are born a gentleman or you aren't. You might be the most retched, horrible person alive, but if you have money you have the title. If you're poor, no amount of suits in the closet or manners will make you one. That's why all masons refer to one another as brother, as not everyone in the lodge would have been "of gentle birth".

I for one don't like the term or use it in reference to myself.

I have to disagree with you 100%. I've known some insufferable SOB's who are very wealthy and from prominent families. What they are are wealthy insufferable SOB's not gentlemen. On the flip side of that I have a good friend who was born addicted to crack, taken from his mother by the state and bounced around foster care for about 8 years before he was finally adopted by an average middle class family. He went on to graduate 3rd in his class in high school and is now a successful doctor with a private practice. He is a gentleman through and through. He wasn't born that way he grew to be one.

[Emmett]

If a lady doesn't like being called a "lady" then she probly doesn't act like one.

Depends on your definition of "lady". She may have a different understanding of it than you. And if she doesn't want to be referred as one, there's no reason she would act like one!

[Emmett]

Sue, I guess I'm just frustrated because some people my age (early 20s) act like morons and it gets very difficult always being the person doing the right thing and NOT acting like an AH. The self satisfaction I get is more than enough, and I would never expect someone to praise me for being a gentleman. I just wish people that acted like AH wouldn't get away with it.

But your absolutely right, I shouldn't let my environment affect my mood and behavior. I should just remain the gen*****nly one. :smile:

Sorry for all the gen*****nly profanity!:tongue:

I realize it can be harder than it sounds to change your surroundings, but if you are surrounded by morons, well, find yourself a new environment. Are in you in college or out? I found the moron quotient to drop off sharply after I left the closed environment of the college campus.

[KarthVader]

I realize it can be harder than it sounds to change your surroundings, but if you are surrounded by morons, well, find yourself a new environment. Are in you in college or out? I found the moron quotient to drop off sharply after I left the closed environment of the college campus.

I graduated a year ago, but I'm finding a trend that more people are acting like morons. In hindsight, I think I am looking for moronic behavior, therefore I will most definitely find it.

[Kratos]

That's not what I take from it at all. The policeman and bar owner are taking the high road by using the same honorific they use for any of their clients. They'd gain nothing by referring to each as a "lowdown dirtball scum" would they? Instead I think it speaks of professionalism.

- Chris

Yeah, talking like that will land you in internal affairs quickly. I prefer "subject" or "suspect" myself. If I say "gentleman" I am being sarcastic.

[toucanlamp]

I have to disagree with you 100%. I've known some insufferable SOB's who are very wealthy and from prominent families. What they are are wealthy insufferable SOB's not gentlemen. On the flip side of that I have a good friend who was born addicted to crack, taken from his mother by the state and bounced around foster care for about 8 years before he was finally adopted by an average middle class family. He went on to graduate 3rd in his class in high school and is now a successful doctor with a private practice. He is a gentleman through and through. He wasn't born that way he grew to be one.

But the entire term gentleman has its origins in referring to someone of high birth. It has taken on a more ambiguous definition in modern times.

[Doc4]

But the entire term gentleman has its origins in referring to someone of high birth. It has taken on a more ambiguous definition in modern times.

But with that high birth came certain expectations of high standards of behaviour. This was a class distinction thing from well before the advent of the industrial bourgeosie and men becoming well-to-do due to wealth rather than birth. Anyhow, over the centuries that followed, the gentry far too often took to acting like us, and the better ones of us took to acting like the gentry were expected to act.

And of course in the New World (ie the US of A) there was no landed gentry and no political will to import one from England.

So the term 'gentleman' does suffer from a bit of (how do you spell "skitz-o-frenia"?) between identifying a man of high birth and any man who behaves like a man of high birth ought to act.



... I will not attempt to expand my explanation to include "gentlemen" when used in a phrase with "club" or "entertainment". :wink2:

[toucanlamp]

But with that high birth came certain expectations of high standards of behaviour. This was a class distinction thing from well before the advent of the industrial bourgeosie and men becoming well-to-do due to wealth rather than birth. Anyhow, over the centuries that followed, the gentry far too often took to acting like us, and the better ones of us took to acting like the gentry were expected to act.

And of course in the New World (ie the US of A) there was no landed gentry and no political will to import one from England.

So the term 'gentleman' does suffer from a bit of (how do you spell "skitz-o-frenia"?) between identifying a man of high birth and any man who behaves like a man of high birth ought to act.



... I will not attempt to expand my explanation to include "gentlemen" when used in a phrase with "club" or "entertainment". :wink2:

But so what does a gentleman mean in the modern context? I would think just someone who is polite and thoughtful of others, not someone who tries to emulate all the habits of someone wealthy who lived a hundred years ago - which is what I think a lot of people on this forum think a gentleman is.

[blackfoot]

But so what does a gentleman mean in the modern context? I would think just someone who is polite and thoughtful of others, not someone who tries to emulate all the habits of someone wealthy who lived a hundred years ago - which is what I think a lot of people on this forum think a gentleman is.

Maybe I misunderstood, but I didn't think anyone here thought that.

[professorchaos]

I have to disagree with you 100%. I've known some insufferable SOB's who are very wealthy and from prominent families. What they are are wealthy insufferable SOB's not gentlemen. On the flip side of that I have a good friend who was born addicted to crack, taken from his mother by the state and bounced around foster care for about 8 years before he was finally adopted by an average middle class family. He went on to graduate 3rd in his class in high school and is now a successful doctor with a private practice. He is a gentleman through and through. He wasn't born that way he grew to be one.

I have to agree with you 100%. Gentlemen are not created by an accident of birth. Being a gentleman is carrying yourself with grace, dignity and humility. It's about self-respect, intellectual refinement and substantive style. It's about having character when life seems to conspire against you.

[_JP_]

As a reminder, Lady and Gent are both four letter words.

:rolleyes5

[Ru4scuba?]

It's about having character when life seems to conspire against you.

Thats about the neatest thing anyone's said on this forum in awhile IMHO...this fits my personal definition of what it means to be a gentleman to a "T"

I've often said that character is defined by how someone turns around a bad situation. You can choose to be a petulant child and let everyone know you're suffering miserably or you can take that bad situation and quietly turn it around into a triumph.

Well said Chaos!

[pastafarian]

There is the famous 'no true scotsman' fallacy that may apply here.

The idea is that Glen says no scotsman puts sugar in his porridge. Then his friend puts out Donald, a man born and raised in Scotland with impeccable scottish ancestry who puts sugar in his porridge every morning. Glen replies, "No TRUE scotsman puts sugar in his porridge".

The way it seems to relate to this discussion is that many people will define a man as someone who acts a certain way. When shown men acting otherwise we say that no 'gentleman' would act against our definition.

We all know what the objective definition of a man is, so let's try not to apply our opinions and call them fact simply by using a special word for them.

As for the idea of being insulted by being called a lady, well that does seem slightly petty. However, if it is used to enforce chauvinistic ideas of women by being used as a term for those who fit our idea of what a woman should be and do then I can see where the offense may stem from.

Having said all of this, if someone is trying to compliment me then it would seem unreasonable for me to attack them for it. No person should react angrily to being talked to in a way that is meant to be kind. Well, no reasonable person should.

[toucanlamp]

Maybe I misunderstood, but I didn't think anyone here thought that.

Well you read things asking what your gentlemanly pursuits are and it includes wearing custom tailored clothing and spats perhaps, escorting a woman into the room using a twenty step process, smoking a pipe and wearing a velvet jacket, debating whether a certain alcoholic beverage qualifies as gentlemanly, using a straight razor etc.

It just seems to equate being a gentleman with emulating the ways of the upper echelons of society from days gone by.

[blackfoot]

Well you read things asking what your gentlemanly pursuits are and it includes wearing custom tailored clothing and spats perhaps, escorting a woman into the room using a twenty step process, smoking a pipe and wearing a velvet jacket, debating whether a certain alcoholic beverage qualifies as gentlemanly, using a straight razor etc.

It just seems to equate being a gentleman with emulating the ways of the upper echelons of society from days gone by.

I will not be wearing a velvet jacket, thank you. :biggrin:

[professorchaos]

Thats about the neatest thing anyone's said on this forum in awhile IMHO...this fits my personal definition of what it means to be a gentleman to a "T"

I've often said that character is defined by how someone turns around a bad situation. You can choose to be a petulant child and let everyone know you're suffering miserably or you can take that bad situation and quietly turn it around into a triumph.

Well said Chaos!

Thank you! It's easy to maintain ethical and moral resolve when everything is going your way, isn't it? Only hard times will tell you what you are made of and where you are wanting.

[SRock]

thats about the neatest thing anyone's said on this forum in awhile imho...this fits my personal definition of what it means to be a gentleman to a "t"

i've often said that character is defined by how someone turns around a bad situation. You can choose to be a petulant child and let everyone know you're suffering miserably or you can take that bad situation and quietly turn it around into a triumph.

Well said chaos!

+1